<![CDATA[Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ :]]>Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ :

- Chrome, Edge, Safari --> @Vivaldi
- iCloud, Google Drive --> @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network, @Mastodon, Cryptee
- Google Search --> @StartpageSearch @Qwant , @ecosia, @Mojeek, Tiger.ch
- MS Office --> @libreoffice
- Gmail --> @Tutanota , @protonprivacy Mail
- iPhone --> @jolla @volla
- iOS, Android --> @murena e/OS

…& much more: https://europeantechmap.eu

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/topic/9fc3dd5b-252f-4582-9ad9-d264ab7c7edd/let-s-do-another-round-of-european-alternatives-to-big-tech-because-we-care-and-we-don-t-gatekeepRSS for NodeThu, 14 May 2026 03:39:00 GMTTue, 05 May 2026 12:38:39 GMT60<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Wed, 06 May 2026 03:40:09 GMT]]>@GrapheneOS @Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota

I think the main criteria of this post's recommendations was "European". I'm guessing GOS doesn't have that geographic requirement.

It's an odd choice to localize privacy recommendations on Vivaldi's part, as opposed to offering the most secure/runner up options.

Wouldn't recommend their phone/OS choices either.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/ap/users/116150821536422869/statuses/116525551437366565https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/ap/users/116150821536422869/statuses/116525551437366565Wed, 06 May 2026 03:40:09 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Wed, 06 May 2026 03:08:32 GMT]]>@ocelot221 @david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi Digital sovereignty refers to government control over data, devices and services of people in the country. GrapheneOS exists to protect users against surveillance including from governments rather than working to enable it. We plan to protect our users from future authoritarian laws in countries where we operate including through willingness to move where we operate if that's ever necessary. /e/ has quite the opposite approach:

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/116353973732143171

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116525427116171835https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116525427116171835Wed, 06 May 2026 03:08:32 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Wed, 06 May 2026 00:08:47 GMT]]>@stonebear2 The linked thread has a video showing what we said. /e/ and Murena have said the same thing in other interviews and their own posts repeatedly and it's not hard to find other examples. We can link to a few more examples if you want to see those. The linked thread has other sources linked in it too.

Read https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/24134-devices-lacking-standard-privacysecurity-patches-and-protections-arent-private and the linked content from Divested Computing in the article. It also has other sources. What we've posted in this thread and there is verifiable info.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116524720318701812https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116524720318701812Wed, 06 May 2026 00:08:47 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 22:17:54 GMT]]>@GrapheneOS @david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi The reason is digital sovereignty.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/ap/users/116367601431286440/statuses/116524284299166916https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/ap/users/116367601431286440/statuses/116524284299166916Tue, 05 May 2026 22:17:54 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 21:37:59 GMT]]>@bermudianbrit @Vivaldi @Tutanota I keep nagging Vivaldi to become accessible to the visually impaired. They say they're working on it. Yup I wish open source were more accessible. the "Just use Linux" you get a lot on here just ain't that easy.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/JustinMac84/statuses/116524127289085160https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/JustinMac84/statuses/116524127289085160Tue, 05 May 2026 21:37:59 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 21:03:09 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @Tutanota @JustinMac84 let's do another round of European alternatives to big tech that are accessible to screen reader users...yeah..the list shortens rather significantly, sadly, because without legal frameworks in place noone caters for accessibility without a legislative gun to their head. I wish it weren't true but it just is. So "because we care" rings a bit hollow.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.online/users/bermudianbrit/statuses/116523990347150658https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.online/users/bermudianbrit/statuses/116523990347150658Tue, 05 May 2026 21:03:09 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 19:27:04 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota @jolla @volla @murena

I missed FairPhone (NL) in the List. It's maybe the most sostainable phone in the market, you can change, update or substitute any component by yourself if you want, without the need of an workshop if something break or get obsolete.

https://www.fairphone.com/repairs

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/users/Catweazle/statuses/116523612559113070https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/users/Catweazle/statuses/116523612559113070Tue, 05 May 2026 19:27:04 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 18:10:51 GMT]]>@GrapheneOS

Strong words, sir, would you care to provide _external_ references?

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://hachyderm.io/users/stonebear2/statuses/116523312844642193https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://hachyderm.io/users/stonebear2/statuses/116523312844642193Tue, 05 May 2026 18:10:51 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 17:52:42 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota @jolla @volla @murena

Check this out:

https://european-alternatives.eu

It's how I found your awesome browser.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/ap/users/115940593092044550/statuses/116523241477889872https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/ap/users/115940593092044550/statuses/116523241477889872Tue, 05 May 2026 17:52:42 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:56:48 GMT]]>@bargo Yep πŸ‘ Thanks.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.tn/users/nizarus/statuses/116523021647919337https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.tn/users/nizarus/statuses/116523021647919337Tue, 05 May 2026 16:56:48 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:48:36 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi SailfishOS keeping most of their user interface and application layer closed source with only the Russian government able to fork it as part of their 2015-2023 partnership is designed to lock in users. The only reason for SailfishOS to keep so much closed source is to keep it under their control.

Volla is pushing adoption of their anti-competitive Unified Attestation putting them in control of which devices and OSes users are allowed to run:

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/116239523775374959

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522989425621182https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522989425621182Tue, 05 May 2026 16:48:36 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:45:13 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi Those devices have awful privacy and security which is not excused by the behavior of other companies. Failing to provide crucial standard privacy and security patches for many months and even multiple years is a serious failure. Not providing important standard standard privacy and security protections needed to stop apps, services and exploit tools from getting user data is also a serious failure. Those 3 companies are exploiting people with their false marketing.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522976111865228https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522976111865228Tue, 05 May 2026 16:45:13 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:42:47 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi GrapheneOS is an international project. It's a non-profit open source project and doesn't have a business model or shareholders. We have a non-profit based in Canada which funds and supports the project but we're free to form non-profits in other countries. The 3 directors of our Canadian non-profit are citizens of Canada, Ukraine and Kazakhstan. Under 10% of our team are Canadian. We don't consider GrapheneOS to have a nationality and don't present it that way.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522966521582385https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522966521582385Tue, 05 May 2026 16:42:47 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:40:00 GMT]]>@GrapheneOS @kris @Vivaldi Let’s not mix things up. The paternalistic behavior of tech companies has nothing to do with security. It’s only about locking users in to exploit them.

Just like some politicians who can't stop talking about keeping people safe, but really just want to take away their freedom.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522955623705661https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522955623705661Tue, 05 May 2026 16:40:00 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:39:33 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota @jolla @volla @murena

- Firefox --> @Waterfox

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/ap/users/115698814574963421/statuses/116522953859512026https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://social.vivaldi.net/ap/users/115698814574963421/statuses/116522953859512026Tue, 05 May 2026 16:39:33 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:31:19 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi From 2015 through 2023, Jolla was largely owned by a Russian state enterprise and heavily worked with the Russian government. Russia has a government fork called Aurora OS despite SailfishOS being largely closed source as they have special access. Russia began invading/occupying Ukraine back in 2014 and was heavily sanctioned. Jolla partnered with them after this was ongoing. The same management who chose that path and stuck with it so long are still running Jolla.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522921491725196https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522921491725196Tue, 05 May 2026 16:31:19 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:13:15 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi iPhones and GrapheneOS devices provide users with strong privacy and security protections. Both are at the leading edge of protecting against privacy and security weaknesses being exploited by apps, services and exploit tools. Meanwhille, /e/ and Murena have heavily pushed the false narrative that strong privacy and security protections mainly benefit criminals to justify the awful privacy and security of their operating system and devices:

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/116353973732143171

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522850406351631https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522850406351631Tue, 05 May 2026 16:13:15 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:10:14 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi It's not unclear why you want the far less private, secure, functional and compatible closed source SailfishOS software stack over open source AOSP.

Volla, Jolla and Murena devices have drastically worse privacy and security than an iPhone. Vivaldi is recommending people move from hardware and software with very strong privacy and security protections to platforms not doing the bare minimum including not providing standard privacy/security patches and protections.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522838553384104https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522838553384104Tue, 05 May 2026 16:10:14 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 16:06:57 GMT]]>@david_bardos @kris @Vivaldi Your claim Google is working to make GrapheneOS devices useless is untrue. If you mean the Play Integrity API, that impacts any OS regardless of whether it's based on the Android Open Source Project (AOSP).

SailfishOS and traditional desktop Linux operating systems are drastically less private and secure than AOSP. Linux doesn't mean glibc, systemd and GNOME. AOSP and GrapheneOS aren't somehow not Linux due to larger userspace differences from desktop Linux.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522825622942416https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522825622942416Tue, 05 May 2026 16:06:57 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 15:57:35 GMT]]>@kris @Vivaldi @GrapheneOS Well, the post was about European alternatives, so Graphene is out of scope being Canadian.

On the other hand, Google is working hard to render both Murena and Graphene based devices useless.

On the long run, I think, pure Linux based alternatives can get us out of this trap. Like SailfishOs from @jolla and @postmarketOS.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522788817238424https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522788817238424Tue, 05 May 2026 15:57:35 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 15:54:38 GMT]]>@stonebear2 @kris @Vivaldi All /e/ and Murena device are missing crucial standard privacy/security patches and protections. The reason they support a massive range of devices is because they don't actually care about privacy but rather only making money. They mislead users about what's provided while sending off their data to third parties and failing to protect them from severe privacy and security holes. They claim strong privacy and security is for criminals.

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/116353973732143171

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522777210120525https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522777210120525Tue, 05 May 2026 15:54:38 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 15:50:43 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota /e/ and Murena have heavily pushed the narrative that protecting strong privacy and security protections primarily benefits criminals. They've repeatedly portrayed providing strong defenses for privacy and security weaknesses as being something not relevant to regular people. Computing devices need far better privacy and security to protect regular people.

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/116353973732143171

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522761798099070https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522761798099070Tue, 05 May 2026 15:50:43 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 15:49:44 GMT]]>@rail @tomminieminen Can you give us something reassuring in this topic? Will this be fixed? @filen

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522757918787273https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mementomori.social/users/david_bardos/statuses/116522757918787273Tue, 05 May 2026 15:49:44 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Let's do another round of European alternatives to Big Tech, because we care and we don't gatekeep πŸ™‚ : on Tue, 05 May 2026 15:48:35 GMT]]>@Vivaldi @protonprivacy @infomaniak_network @Mastodon @StartpageSearch @Qwant @ecosia @Mojeek @libreoffice @Tutanota Moving from an iPhone to a device from Jolla, Volla or Murena is a massive downgrade for privacy and security. You're recommending people use devices failing to provide crucial standard privacy/security patches and protections. Using devices which lag many months to even years behind upstream patches isn't safe. It's an extreme contrast with iPhones protecting strong protections.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522753438845416https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://grapheneos.social/users/GrapheneOS/statuses/116522753438845416Tue, 05 May 2026 15:48:35 GMT