<![CDATA[Countercomputing Manifesto]]>Countercomputing Manifesto

Draft 0.0.1

For decades, computing power has been steadily growing, without a commensurate boost in the utility to the user. In fact, this increase in power has largely been used against the user -- extracting value from the user, at little or no benefit to the user, primarily for the benefit of corporations who produce and sell nothing of real utility themselves.

We assert that the sole agency over the use and output of privately owned tools belongs with and only with the owners of those tools; we assert an inherent right to decide for ourselves what software will and won't run, and when, on computers we own and operate for our own private benefit, and the same right held collectively over shared computers.

Further, we assert the right to revoke our consent to be used as a resource by the advertising and surveillance industries, as well as any other party not named specifically.

We therefore resolve to create, under common purpose and shared ownership, a new standard for a computing device, which is designed to educate and empower the owner, rather than to expose and exploit them.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/topic/ce295f2e-a0b7-4999-a0c3-a7fbb573a99f/countercomputing-manifestoRSS for NodeThu, 30 Apr 2026 04:51:58 GMTWed, 08 Apr 2026 17:06:11 GMT60<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Mon, 13 Apr 2026 00:30:13 GMT]]>@hatzka Arguably yes, and that sort of thing is why it’s a first draft.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116394571450475337https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116394571450475337Mon, 13 Apr 2026 00:30:13 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Mon, 13 Apr 2026 00:17:00 GMT]]>@hatzka There’s a severe shortage of purchasable parts to use those interfaces. I can’t just go to Mouser and buy a PCIe UART or the like. And that’s to say nothing of the board level design insanity you have to do to make use of DDR SDRAM.

Older, slower interfaces may well be older and slower, but they have their own advantages.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116394519434185263https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116394519434185263Mon, 13 Apr 2026 00:17:00 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:53:44 GMT]]>@hatzka You can, and it gets you freedom to choose components much more freely. I’m not personally a Z80 guy historically, I’m big invested in 6502 and 65816, but of the options that leave designers free to select components properly, the eZ80 offers the best performance. A discrete RISC-V would blow it out of the water easily, if only someone would make one.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393956084434121https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393956084434121Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:53:44 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:40:15 GMT]]>@hatzka I can’t take a design built around the chip from an rpi and sub in the chip from a pine board.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393903117323252https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393903117323252Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:40:15 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:35:04 GMT]]>@hatzka That there isn’t a good alternative? I feel like we’re talking past each other. Modern SoCs are unsuitable for a dozen good reasons. Much as I’d love it to be otherwise - that’s why I’d love to see a good RISC-V FPGA core with an exposed bus.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393882724578089https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393882724578089Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:35:04 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:10:47 GMT]]>@mos_8502@studio8502.ca @TomGwozdz@oldbytes.space

i think risc-v is designed for this sort of thing

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://app.wafrn.net/fediverse/post/daf2b795-deb1-40a2-87b1-448008858a91https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://app.wafrn.net/fediverse/post/daf2b795-deb1-40a2-87b1-448008858a91Sun, 12 Apr 2026 21:10:47 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 19:46:33 GMT]]>@hatzka Modern MPUs tend to provide very proprietary interfaces. It’s not even possible to access the graphics acceleration on a Pi5 without Linux blobs.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393455997988081https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393455997988081Sun, 12 Apr 2026 19:46:33 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Sun, 12 Apr 2026 19:10:14 GMT]]>@hatzka Doesn’t have to be memory mapped. Just has to be some kind of parallel bus suitable for connecting, for example, a serial UART.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393313207201558https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116393313207201558Sun, 12 Apr 2026 19:10:14 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 22:56:51 GMT]]>@mos_8502 I haven't used CP/M since my Commodore 128 days. While I agree CP/M is a "punk rock" choice, it wasn't the most fun thing to actually use. GEOS on the C128 though was very serviceable. I wonder how hard it'd be to make a GEOSish thing for the Z80 that could use CP/M for a terminal?

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/Feneric/statuses/116371555031812001https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/Feneric/statuses/116371555031812001Wed, 08 Apr 2026 22:56:51 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 21:41:29 GMT]]>@mos_8502 Regarding Level 2, I think it might be make sense to have AmigaDOS like...long name, friendly command set, etc. Not complicated like UN*X/bash.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://masto.hackers.town/users/thebluewizard/statuses/116371258715416563https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://masto.hackers.town/users/thebluewizard/statuses/116371258715416563Wed, 08 Apr 2026 21:41:29 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 20:30:30 GMT]]>@mos_8502 This might be of interest to you - "how to implement memory and I/O protection on a z80 with minimal external circuit." https://youtu.be/DLSUAVPKeYk

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mas.to/users/pauld/statuses/116370979584710674https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mas.to/users/pauld/statuses/116370979584710674Wed, 08 Apr 2026 20:30:30 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:56:28 GMT]]>@mei @mos_8502 I wonder if some 8-bit equivalent of WASM would work here for verifying that programs don't access memory they're not supposed to.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/crzwdjk/statuses/116370845763886358https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/crzwdjk/statuses/116370845763886358Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:56:28 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:53:44 GMT]]>@mei @mos_8502 You can do multitasking just fine without an MMU, you just have to trust the programs not to poke addresses they're not supposed to. This is the approach taken by 68k macs. The main thing you need is code that is position independent, something that 6502 isn't really designed for especially since zero page and stack are fixed addresses. But I think the 816 is a bit more flexible, and ez80 probably more flexible still.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/crzwdjk/statuses/116370835024702816https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/crzwdjk/statuses/116370835024702816Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:53:44 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:15:50 GMT]]>@mei I know it has some kind of memory management that lets you program the chip selects.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370686008838060https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370686008838060Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:15:50 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:13:34 GMT]]>@mos_8502 hm, what are the capabilities of the eZ80's "something like an MMU"? I tried looking it up in the datasheet real quick but didn't find anything that I'd expect to be what you're referring to...]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://donotsta.re/objects/d5cda969-5e1d-433a-8a53-4f5015331986https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://donotsta.re/objects/d5cda969-5e1d-433a-8a53-4f5015331986Wed, 08 Apr 2026 19:13:34 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:57:41 GMT]]>@mos_8502 Seconding the Z80. RC2014 has a massive ecosystem on Tindie etc. The Microbeast is halfway to a portable option. I think as soon as someone opens a central place to dump info and plug it into this framework to make those things do actual, current day work instead of just being individual pieces of nostalgia and experimentation, that place will be packed within a year.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/mandelhorn/statuses/116370614606027547https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.social/users/mandelhorn/statuses/116370614606027547Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:57:41 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:52:22 GMT]]>@mei The Z180 and eZ80 have something like an MMU baked in, but multitasking may be asking a bit much.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370593713748535https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370593713748535Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:52:22 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:37:24 GMT]]>@mos_8502 hm, does either the Z80 or 6502 family support an MMU? I feel like a proper multi-tasking operating system would be hard to support otherwise...]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://donotsta.re/objects/85ef2263-495c-4653-a403-7bc381f9d29dhttps://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://donotsta.re/objects/85ef2263-495c-4653-a403-7bc381f9d29dWed, 08 Apr 2026 18:37:24 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:20:34 GMT]]>The level 1 hardware standards would be designed to use as much common, off-the-shelf hardware as possible, to make it easier to build a compliant system.

Imagine, for example, an RCBus system that fit into an ATX case and power supply?

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370468698626176https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370468698626176Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:20:34 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:15:06 GMT]]>@mos_8502 I wonder how hard it would be to port UXN to a system like that.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://woof.tech/users/meluzzy/statuses/116370447150690282https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://woof.tech/users/meluzzy/statuses/116370447150690282Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:15:06 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:10:43 GMT]]>Let us make a temporary, for-the-sake-of-argument example of what standards might look like:

Level 0:
- Z80 CPU at 18MHz or faster
- VT-100 terminal or compatible emulation
- ROMWBW HBIOS/CBIOS Support
- CP/M-3

So level 0 is intentionally very broad, and essentially a reification of several existing systems.

Level 1:
- All requirements for Level 0
- 512KB of RAM
- Hardware designed according to the level 1 guidelines (replacing RC2014 or the like)

Level 2:
- All requirements for levels 0 and 1
- CP/M-3 replaced with custom community-built OS (think MSX-DOS but with long file names).

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370429936181671https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370429936181671Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:10:43 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:06:06 GMT]]>@mos_8502

I like where you're going with this. We need a new personal computer revolution that stays personal and accessible.

Once the corpos took control of the PC revolution they steered it in the direction they wanted. The new revolution needs more people like Woz and his open designs and less people like Steve Jobs and Epstein's good friends like Bill Gates.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://infosec.exchange/ap/users/115833042784456710/statuses/116370411751780478https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://infosec.exchange/ap/users/115833042784456710/statuses/116370411751780478Wed, 08 Apr 2026 18:06:06 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 17:56:22 GMT]]>@mos_8502
As long as you provide simple IO routines, you can run C64/PET BASIC on the 6502. The C64 kernel has actually quite a nice operating system API even though it's single threaded and lacks in memory management. Itball comes down to providing IO drivers

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.online/users/afachat/statuses/116370373496627903https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://mastodon.online/users/afachat/statuses/116370373496627903Wed, 08 Apr 2026 17:56:22 GMT<![CDATA[Reply to Countercomputing Manifesto on Wed, 08 Apr 2026 17:55:33 GMT]]>Then again, there is an excellent cross-compiler for the 65816 arch (Calypsi), which might make developing an OS easier.

All of this is moot, of course, if there turns out to be a better option for CPU.

]]>https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370370268017544https://forum.fedi.dk/post/https://studio8502.ca/users/mos_8502/statuses/116370370268017544Wed, 08 Apr 2026 17:55:33 GMT