thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
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@SnoopJ plot twist: trolley has turntable wheels like all modern trains and the front axis goes on one rail while the trolley is diagonally hanging to the second track. Everyone gets killed.
@MBEverding @SnoopJ Including any passengers on the trolley after it derails. The maximally destructive option.
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ
As I recall from my HO scale model trains, just leaving the switch idling between the two positions will do it too. The first axle to reach it will be dumped on the ground, possibly getting hung up on the frog on the way over. The results will always be suboptimal to say the least -
thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ
which means, the people inside the trolley will be sacrificed -
@SnoopJ how do we know this wouldn't happen, though?
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Isn't that the same thing all of the "drift the trolley across both tracks to hit everyone" are suggesting?
@agowa338 @SnoopJ That depends on
1. the speed and weight of the trolley;
2. the separation of the tracks;
3. the articulation of the bogies.If it's running at the speed of, say, the new Ontario light rail line, no one will get hurt because it's running too slow to fall over and will just stop in a short distance. If it's a Shinkansen, you've got problems.
But the unionised workers on the ground know which it is and can act appropriately
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
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@SnoopJ
which means, the people inside the trolley will be sacrificed@ki
1) It's a trolley, not a train, so its speed is limited, making a derailment less dangerous.
3) the trolley seems to be empty, otherwise someone would be able to engage the safety break
4) no passengers are mentioned, which further implies that the trolley is empty
5) No drivers is mentioned, combined with a braking distance of ~55m for old style trams at 50km/h that again strongly implies that the trolley is empty -
@agowa338 @SnoopJ That depends on
1. the speed and weight of the trolley;
2. the separation of the tracks;
3. the articulation of the bogies.If it's running at the speed of, say, the new Ontario light rail line, no one will get hurt because it's running too slow to fall over and will just stop in a short distance. If it's a Shinkansen, you've got problems.
But the unionised workers on the ground know which it is and can act appropriately
If you want to over analyse it you could also have the issue that the track does not allow being changed once a part of the train passed over it until it fully cleared again...
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@ki
1) It's a trolley, not a train, so its speed is limited, making a derailment less dangerous.
3) the trolley seems to be empty, otherwise someone would be able to engage the safety break
4) no passengers are mentioned, which further implies that the trolley is empty
5) No drivers is mentioned, combined with a braking distance of ~55m for old style trams at 50km/h that again strongly implies that the trolley is empty1. you can still get injured or die in a trolley accident, derailment is still quite dangerous, making it a sacrifice.
2. they're glued to their phones, nobody near an emergency break notices. also, this particular trolley doesn't have an emergency break
3. no air is mentioned, further implying that everyone suffocates anyway? no, a trolley comes with people and this one is quite crowded because the scene is taking place during rush hour -
1. you can still get injured or die in a trolley accident, derailment is still quite dangerous, making it a sacrifice.
2. they're glued to their phones, nobody near an emergency break notices. also, this particular trolley doesn't have an emergency break
3. no air is mentioned, further implying that everyone suffocates anyway? no, a trolley comes with people and this one is quite crowded because the scene is taking place during rush hour -
thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ
Reverse the problem. What do you do if it's Trump strapped to one line and Putin to the other (other malign leaders are available)?None of the proposed solutions would achieve an optimum outcome!
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ
The person doing that will be SO fired! -
thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ@hachyderm.io so basically the solution is to put the blame on the ones who do the job, driving them to the destruction of the production means.
not the best endorsement for unions…
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
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like, one might be tempted to say "noooo it's a constructed hypothetical that only admits these two options"
but there's something really lovely about a union coming in and being like "ah, no, a different world is possible"
@SnoopJ I refuse these two options! The correct answer is "doing nothing". Miliions of people die everyday without my intervention and I don't feel guilty about it!
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ i have been telling this for ages finally somebody updated the meme
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What I particularly love about this is that it completely works as a metaphor as well:
The true solution when you face a "trolley problem" in real life is to study more detail to find additional options. Because no real world situation is ever this binary.
@TerryHancock @SnoopJ I think that's why the hypothetical thought experiment has such urgency built into it. Decide now! Flip the switch or not. Push the fat man or not. Tick tock. Tick tock.
A similar tactic to that used by phishers. And the response is the same: "Nothing is that urgent. Stop. Breathe. Think."
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thinking about how there's a true solution to the trolley problem and union workers were the ones to point it out
@SnoopJ Doesn't trolley problem exists only to highlight that no matter the decision you make you are the one deciding who is getting harmed or in this scenario, who is going to take on risk of being injured. This problem exists to make you think about philosophy, law and ethics. Obviously in the real world there are practical solutions that minimize risk and make sure that least amount of people gets harmed, but again, this is hypothetical scenario meant for students.
