I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide I look forward to Vulnhalla, where the CISOs are all busy feasting and the humans can run rampant with hand-crafted exploits.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide I’m hoping it leads to more safe languages, use of formal verification wherever possible, real engineering standards, and liability when software fucks up
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@evacide why?
Because to me (a computer scientist, but not a security researcher) it would seem like a likely outcome.
@UlrikNyman The very short version is that the attack surface is nearly infinite while resources are extremely finite.
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@evacide I’m hoping it leads to more safe languages, use of formal verification wherever possible, real engineering standards, and liability when software fucks up
@sus This is also what I am hoping for.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide We can only get to Vulnhallah by dying and get picked up by the Valkyries, as far as I understand. I'd like to wait a few decades.
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@evacide We can only get to Vulnhallah by dying and get picked up by the Valkyries, as far as I understand. I'd like to wait a few decades.
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@silverwizard @evacide Yes. I clearly mistyped.
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@evacide I’m hoping it leads to more safe languages, use of formal verification wherever possible, real engineering standards, and liability when software fucks up
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@UlrikNyman The very short version is that the attack surface is nearly infinite while resources are extremely finite.
@evacide@hachyderm.io @UlrikNyman@mastodon.social
Ulrik, think about it this way: LLMs are probabilistic machines. If we write some code with a bunch of memory safety issues and set LLMs against it to find them, resource expenditure approaches infinity as number of memory safety issues approaches zero. If instead, as another commenter suggested, we wrote in memory safe or formally verifiable languages, we expend a greater, but constant, amount of resources up front to start from a position of zero or nearly zero memory safety issues.
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@silverwizard @evacide Yes. I clearly mistyped.
@m @silverwizard @evacide There cannot possibly be any way to get from Vulnpocalypse to Vulnhalla. To get to Vulnhalla, you'd need to start at Vulnarok.
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@m @silverwizard @evacide There cannot possibly be any way to get from Vulnpocalypse to Vulnhalla. To get to Vulnhalla, you'd need to start at Vulnarok.
@datarama @m @silverwizard You have correctly noticed that I am mixing my religious paradigms.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide "Return my tokens to me, and I myself will carry you to the gates of Vulnhalla. You will crash eternal, Firefox and Chrome!" -- Immortan Claude
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@m @silverwizard @evacide There cannot possibly be any way to get from Vulnpocalypse to Vulnhalla. To get to Vulnhalla, you'd need to start at Vulnarok.
@datarama @m @silverwizard @evacide To get to Valhalla, one had to die in battle or some other *honorable* activity. Once there, people entertained themselves every day by dying in battles, just to rise again for the big feast at dinner, eating the big boar Sæhrímnir. Every day the same again, a bit like in "Heaven" by the Talking Heads.
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@datarama @m @silverwizard @evacide To get to Valhalla, one had to die in battle or some other *honorable* activity. Once there, people entertained themselves every day by dying in battles, just to rise again for the big feast at dinner, eating the big boar Sæhrímnir. Every day the same again, a bit like in "Heaven" by the Talking Heads.
@datarama @m @silverwizard @evacide No wonder that a disruptor like Loki, the big villain in those stories, started by getting Baldur killed. Baldur was the god of wisdom and decency, twin brother of Bragi the god of poetry and storytelling.
The point is that by killing beauty, people will lose the meaning for living their lives.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide Vulnarok?
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
Certainly not the feasting. This path leads to ruin.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide follow me and i will send you photos of my rabbits feet *sfw
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
... maybe, we could have the Humans write some secure code.
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I understand that there are people who think we must pass through the Vulnpocalypse to get to Vulnhallah, a time when all code is written by AI then checked by AI and has no vulns that AI can find, while we sit back and feast. But I don't think we can get there from here.
@evacide
So AI will write the bugs, AI will find the bugs, and humans will just sit there pretending they understand the code?
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