Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels.
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There’s some argument here that electricity is too costly in the EU. If that *is* true, how do you fix it? Renewables are the only way. Even *were* nuclear the solution you can’t get it in a decade. And you don’t want to burn gas. #StateOfEU
This is just basically a question of big business profitability. Drive down electricity costs, and shove those costs onto the state to add network capacity to drive down your costs. #StateOfEU
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@jon and the jerk lets the cat roam free, while wind turbines are stationary.
Our cats would love to have a bird to kill.
Thanks to conventional agriculture and overdoing gardenweeders all around here, there is nothing left to feed on for birds.
Neither windturbines, nor cats are the biggest theeat to the birds population.
We humans with our tidy fields and gardens are the cause.
Sad enough
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Our cats would love to have a bird to kill.
Thanks to conventional agriculture and overdoing gardenweeders all around here, there is nothing left to feed on for birds.
Neither windturbines, nor cats are the biggest theeat to the birds population.
We humans with our tidy fields and gardens are the cause.
Sad enough
@Derek_DIY "free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals (...)
More birds die from cat encounters than from collisions with buildings, communication tower, or vehicles, or poisoning by pesticides".
https://www.audubon.org/news/cats-pose-even-bigger-threat-birds-previously-thought
It's a bad conclusion for cat lovers, but all they have to do is keep their cats indoors, simple as that.
@jon -
This is just basically a question of big business profitability. Drive down electricity costs, and shove those costs onto the state to add network capacity to drive down your costs. #StateOfEU
At least the business dude knows how to present. The politicians, not so much. #StateOfEU
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Can you not at least make a bad point coherently? #StateOfEU
@jon
I wonder how many birds and fish and mammals are killed by coal plants...?
Or heat waves, for that matter.Nobody likes loving next to industrial infrastructure, and quite a lot of land is used to import, export, refine, and distribute those archaic power sources.
Whose houses voted to have the gas peaker plants pop up next to them?
Many of those generators were built with the truncheon of State power and later "sold" for "private management"
I'm done asking. I'm demanding parity.
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This is the ethical point here: NOTHING is more important than combatting climate change. Nothing. Without a liveable planet nothing else works. I’ll have a debate about the numbers, and how to decarbonise. But I’ve no time for whataboutism, nimbyism or conspiracy theories. #StateOfEU
@jon well I strongly agree with your point but then the natural consequence is "I'm ready to accept an increase in inequality in order to stop climate change". I do but this seems to be very uncommon.
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Turbines kill birds. They don’t you jerk. Your cat is more a danger to birds. #StateOfEU
Edit: for clarification - the number isn’t zero. But it’s not a significant issue.
@jon and anyone who's worried about it can paint one blade black and reduce deaths dramatically. If that were standard at the factory, the cost could be negligible.
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@jon There is even an EU-funded project about Red kite and Wind turbines.
Human caused deads of Red kite are caused by rat poison.
https://www.life-eurokite.eu/ -
Turbines kill birds. They don’t you jerk. Your cat is more a danger to birds. #StateOfEU
Edit: for clarification - the number isn’t zero. But it’s not a significant issue.
@jon do they all have stickers on their windows ?
More birds killed by windows than turbines - a simple sticker can help ..
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@jon They did an experiment where they painted (one of?) the blades in black to make it more visible, which reduced the number of dead birds by 70%.
https://www.intelligentliving.co/norway-bird-deaths-black-turbine-blades/
@mikaeleiman @jon The same can be done to cats but it sadly has no effect on bird deaths.
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon WelcomePlease help us, we need food and we are crying from hunger. Please, if$20
🥹
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@simon_brooke @jon
"At the moment (09/2024), 1,377 tagged red kites have died (506 red kites with transmitter failures). 195 tagged red kites died from poisoning and 54 from illegal shooting. 622 tagged red kites died from other anthropogenic and natural causes such as predation, collision, electrocution or disease."
Regarding Wind turbines it is also interesting that the newer, bigger ones are even less dangerous for birds as they usually simply do not fly this high. -
Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
I suspect governments will,resist renewable energy until they figure out a way to tax it. As you point out, once the infrastructure is installed, once the capital costs are met;
The energy is free … -
Most of these people have been buttering up notionally powerful people for so long they can no longer make a coherent point or have a coherent thought. It’s grim. #StateOfEU
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And the moderator used the typical fossil fuels talking point that dependence on fossil fuels is just as problematic as dependence on Chinese solar panels. These are NOT equivalent! Once you’ve got your solar panel it is yours. #StateOfEU
@jon@gruene.social As Technology Connections says - "Renewable energy means we can stop setting money on fire"
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This is just basically a question of big business profitability. Drive down electricity costs, and shove those costs onto the state to add network capacity to drive down your costs. #StateOfEU
@jon
Only with centralised big plants and an according distribution system big companies can make big money.
Decentralised production and distribution leaves too much money at the bases, like villages, towns, etc.
And the big players have the big lobby.I hope you got some steam out of your system. Only people like you have influence, albeit it is slow going.
Keep your patience and keep going, I and likely others too are grateful for this.
#StateofEU #energy -
@jon well I strongly agree with your point but then the natural consequence is "I'm ready to accept an increase in inequality in order to stop climate change". I do but this seems to be very uncommon.
@lucalicalzi strikes me as a false choice. Why would combatting climate change increase inequality?
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I'm still not sure how they reached that conclusion.
They monitored two groups of 4 turbines each, from 2006-2016. In 2013 they painted blades of one turbine group.
The numbers of dead birds found at these turbines (excluding Willow ptarmigan):
Before:
control group: 7
impact group: 11After:
control group: 18
impact group: 6(plus 40 Willow ptarmigan)
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ece3.6592
And yes, that's 82 dead birds in 80 turbine years.
@billiglarper @mikaeleiman @jon
And yes, that's 82 dead birds in 80 turbine years.
How does that compare with large glass office buildings?
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@Derek_DIY "free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals (...)
More birds die from cat encounters than from collisions with buildings, communication tower, or vehicles, or poisoning by pesticides".
https://www.audubon.org/news/cats-pose-even-bigger-threat-birds-previously-thought
It's a bad conclusion for cat lovers, but all they have to do is keep their cats indoors, simple as that.
@jonCats that are not used to be inside will make your life a hell.
Not to mention, that we care for 17 cats (and some are nit clean).
Imagine that with four persons in a small appartment.
🥶
Nonetheless I will give that article a read.
Hope there will be more responsible people around which at least neuter their cats.
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At least the business dude knows how to present. The politicians, not so much. #StateOfEU
I had to rush from #StateOfEU to go get a train. But the moderator came to me afterwards, rather offended by me having accused her of using fossil fuel talking points. I explained I didn’t want to deliberately cause offence, but that she ought to be aware. She did acknowledge the issue. That’s something.
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