"AI" is a failed technology, in the sense that it's neither fit for purpose, nor a likely path to its stated end goal of "AGI", but a lot of people's profits currently depend on pretending it's not.
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@golemwire Local model of what? Language model for general purpose/coding?
They are better under the consume aspect, but they share the same problem in all the other aspects (stolen training data, salevry-like training, sociological and psychological impact and so on).I did mean local model as in local LLM, like Qwen, DeepSeek, or GLM, and probably for coding or other such tasks.
I think some people don't understand the implications of posting content in the public.
When you do that, while people can't take it and redistribute it, as far as I can tell it is fair use to use it to create something else that can then create something else that is different from the original. That seems like fair use to me, so long as the models aren't regurgitating the same training data, but that's still debated obviously.
As for the sociological and psychological impact, this is one of the reasons I discourage some of my friends from relying on it. My usecases are narrow enough that I've only benefited. But there's little point in me avoiding using it for good purposes, since avoiding it won't stop other people from using it for bad.
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@Gargron @imhotep @skavish On the other hand you say in another post, that you have never used AI, but maintaining one of the biggest FOSS project on GitHub is enough expertise.
Im no Dev, but I assume Linux may be a even bigger FOSS project and Linus explored AI. According to your argumentation, he is as capable as you, if not more, to make guesses about GenAI.
Or what’s the difference, that make your opinion superior to his one?
@kernic @Gargron @imhotep @skavish not «superior» I think, just watching the influx of low quality «contributions», another well documented issue in pretty much any open source repo, I think is enough experience to speak about AI impact in society irrespective of the fact that someone finds it useful.
The same is happening in most companies with much less visible impact at the moment. AI is an amplifier. Everyone that was slowly going in the wrong direction, now is going faster. -
I did mean local model as in local LLM, like Qwen, DeepSeek, or GLM, and probably for coding or other such tasks.
I think some people don't understand the implications of posting content in the public.
When you do that, while people can't take it and redistribute it, as far as I can tell it is fair use to use it to create something else that can then create something else that is different from the original. That seems like fair use to me, so long as the models aren't regurgitating the same training data, but that's still debated obviously.
As for the sociological and psychological impact, this is one of the reasons I discourage some of my friends from relying on it. My usecases are narrow enough that I've only benefited. But there's little point in me avoiding using it for good purposes, since avoiding it won't stop other people from using it for bad.What? You don't know what fair use is, man.
You absolutely cannot do whatever you want with things just because they are online, especially when protected by copyright or other licenses. -
What? You don't know what fair use is, man.
You absolutely cannot do whatever you want with things just because they are online, especially when protected by copyright or other licenses.I didn't say you can do whatever you like with online things just because they're online. For example I said that you should not redistribute them and that the models should not output training data (thus redistributing, more or less). Instead, they produce new content. But the legality of training AI from random public-facing data is still debated.
I found this PDF from a court case with Anthropic: https://www.copyright.gov/fair-use/summaries/Bartz-v-Anthropic-PBC-787-F-Supp-3d-1007-ND-Cal-2025.pdf
In this court case, it was said that Anthropic could train on copyrighted works since its AI model did not output said copyrighted works. It was also concluded that Anthropic was at fault for keeping copies of the books after using them for training, and had to delete the copies.
I avoid Claude (haven't used it) because they apparently didn't obtain all of the books legitimately, using piracy sites for some of the downloads rather than purchasing all the books.
While I avoid particular LLMs, I consider LLM training in general to be fair use. Though I can't fault someone for rejecting LLMs for considering them not to be.
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"AI" is a failed technology, in the sense that it's neither fit for purpose, nor a likely path to its stated end goal of "AGI", but a lot of people's profits currently depend on pretending it's not. I am curious to see how long the hype will last once the Nvidia ouroboros ends and money stops being pumped into marketing.
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@mellowfish @Gargron I do not find your personal experience convincing.
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@Shes_Gabrielle @FreakyFwoof @skavish @Gargron excellent definition of centrism, and I'll stop here. Many implications.
@precariousmind
@Shes_Gabrielle @FreakyFwoof @skavish@welley.social @Gargron
Many such cases. -
of course
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i agree with most of that. but ai isn’t going anywhere, so might as well use it. moral outrage won’t uninvent it.
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"AI" is a failed technology, in the sense that it's neither fit for purpose, nor a likely path to its stated end goal of "AGI", but a lot of people's profits currently depend on pretending it's not. I am curious to see how long the hype will last once the Nvidia ouroboros ends and money stops being pumped into marketing.
@Gargron it's a direct attack on labor, be it in forced consent or forcing tech workers out of high salary jobs
Unfortunately it will have staying power until we can wrangle in billionaire's
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@kernic @Gargron @imhotep @skavish not «superior» I think, just watching the influx of low quality «contributions», another well documented issue in pretty much any open source repo, I think is enough experience to speak about AI impact in society irrespective of the fact that someone finds it useful.
The same is happening in most companies with much less visible impact at the moment. AI is an amplifier. Everyone that was slowly going in the wrong direction, now is going faster.@olonam @kernic @Gargron @skavish Drowning the world in low quality tat not exactly a novel idea. The maleficarum chaos for a few hundred years after Guttenberg, KJV & Penny Press well documented and still causing chaos.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penny_press
It's getting faster, but it's been pretty fast since 1500 or so.
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i agree with most of that. but ai isn’t going anywhere, so might as well use it. moral outrage won’t uninvent it.
@skavish "yeah, slavery is bad, but it's there. So might as well exploit some".
Have some spine and take responsibility for what you believe, or else you're fuckin responsible. What a child.
AI is a human thing, not a fucking necessity.
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"AI" is a failed technology, in the sense that it's neither fit for purpose, nor a likely path to its stated end goal of "AGI", but a lot of people's profits currently depend on pretending it's not. I am curious to see how long the hype will last once the Nvidia ouroboros ends and money stops being pumped into marketing.
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"AI" is a failed technology, in the sense that it's neither fit for purpose, nor a likely path to its stated end goal of "AGI", but a lot of people's profits currently depend on pretending it's not. I am curious to see how long the hype will last once the Nvidia ouroboros ends and money stops being pumped into marketing.
@Gargron My god, this is a sweet block honeypot.
Almost every single answer to this post comes from a fucking weak minded piece of shit that actively wants to harm humanity.
Delightful. Thanks for this.
I didn’t know that this scum had infiltrated so deep in the Fediverse, good to know.
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@Gargron It probably writes better code than you do at this point. Anyone who calls it spaghetti code TODAY has no clue what it’s capable of.
There’s a reason mathematicians are freaked out. Their heads aren’t in the sand
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@kernic @Gargron @imhotep @skavish not «superior» I think, just watching the influx of low quality «contributions», another well documented issue in pretty much any open source repo, I think is enough experience to speak about AI impact in society irrespective of the fact that someone finds it useful.
The same is happening in most companies with much less visible impact at the moment. AI is an amplifier. Everyone that was slowly going in the wrong direction, now is going faster.@olonam @Gargron @imhotep @skavish
No doubt there is currently a lot of shit done with AI/LLM. I also see, that the AI race is absolut madness and there will be a big crash some day.
But LLM/ML are tools (let’s not call it AI, there is nothing intelligent), and these tools have use cases.
It’s all about using them the right way. Currently it’s more like „When you have a hammer, everything seems to be a nail.“ -
@Gargron
The world has changed. This is just the awkward beginning. There is no realistic scenario where we go back to 2022.Yea … I keep thinking that the “this will all crash and blow over” anti AI group might be one of the most damaging groups out there right now.
Between giving lots of peeps false hope and the average person probably having a decent awareness of the existence of the problems with AI, I’m just not sure that their perspectives serve anything other than their egos (which I get, but still).
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J jwcph@helvede.net shared this topic
all the way down, and that’s why wankers love 
it *so much!*
