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  3. New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

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  • mrsbeanbag@ieji.deM mrsbeanbag@ieji.de

    @iris_meredith i have been thinking about this very claim lately, and my conclusion is that it isn't *even* a tool. a tool is something you control, and with practice, master. you don't control an LLM. you just sort of, ask it, and it obeys, more or less, according to its interpretation of what you asked for. that's not a tool, it's a servant.

    H This user is from outside of this forum
    H This user is from outside of this forum
    hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #7
    @mrsbeanbag @iris_meredith No, I’d argue it’s still a tool, but end users are part of the input/output of the tool, the people who are wielding it are only the ones making it.
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    • kats@chaosfem.twK kats@chaosfem.tw

      @iris_meredith Insightful.

      I also like that it helpfully explains why this Tailwind thing becomes such an issue from time to time.

      H This user is from outside of this forum
      H This user is from outside of this forum
      hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #8
      @KatS @iris_meredith Huh, I didn’t expect to see Tailwind mentioned here but I guess it aligns with a recent rant of mine about it: friendica.mrpetovan.com/displa…
      1 Reply Last reply
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      • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

        New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

        https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

        A This user is from outside of this forum
        A This user is from outside of this forum
        andydearden@mastodon.green
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #9

        @iris_meredith I do wnder whether Bruno Latour should also be cited in this argument. Are these gestalts equivalent to actants?

        iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI 1 Reply Last reply
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        • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

          New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

          https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

          jpshoer@mastodon.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
          jpshoer@mastodon.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
          jpshoer@mastodon.social
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #10

          @iris_meredith Great essay! I've been thinking about these sorts of issues, too, from the perspective of an aerospace engineer.

          "Technology is neither good nor evil, it's how you use it! Now, we shall proceed with developing this new technology for which the use case was defined in advance, and the use case is....uh...."

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

            New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

            https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

            _ryekdarkener_@mastodon.social_ This user is from outside of this forum
            _ryekdarkener_@mastodon.social_ This user is from outside of this forum
            _ryekdarkener_@mastodon.social
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #11

            @iris_meredith

            Good point. Essentially, it boils down to the fact that using the object intelligently turns it into ‘just a tool’ and a part of our (expanded) cultural existence.
            For people who use forks without any interest in or knowledge of their specific capabilities, a fork is simply a magical device that either helps or seems threatening – in a way that people do not want to understand.

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

              New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

              https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

              gudenau@hachyderm.ioG This user is from outside of this forum
              gudenau@hachyderm.ioG This user is from outside of this forum
              gudenau@hachyderm.io
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #12

              @iris_meredith Yeah, if industry is good at one thing it's good at skirting responsibility. It's a thing everywhere, the government is meant to push back against it. The food industry and the FDA, big oil and the EPA, big tech and the GDPR, etc..

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                daseinsappeal@troet.cafeD This user is from outside of this forum
                daseinsappeal@troet.cafeD This user is from outside of this forum
                daseinsappeal@troet.cafe
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #13

                @iris_meredith Aaah! Finally someone scratching where it used to itch for thirty years. Thanks!

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • mrsbeanbag@ieji.deM mrsbeanbag@ieji.de

                  @iris_meredith i have been thinking about this very claim lately, and my conclusion is that it isn't *even* a tool. a tool is something you control, and with practice, master. you don't control an LLM. you just sort of, ask it, and it obeys, more or less, according to its interpretation of what you asked for. that's not a tool, it's a servant.

                  db@magrathea.spaceD This user is from outside of this forum
                  db@magrathea.spaceD This user is from outside of this forum
                  db@magrathea.space
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #14
                  @mrsbeanbag @iris_meredith I think that’s why certain kinds of people love them so much.
                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                    New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                    https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                    dandean@indieweb.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                    dandean@indieweb.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                    dandean@indieweb.social
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #15

                    @iris_meredith I appreciate the way you piece together the way a tool’s design influences thinking, actions, and the resulting reality we bring into the world.

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • A andydearden@mastodon.green

                      @iris_meredith I do wnder whether Bruno Latour should also be cited in this argument. Are these gestalts equivalent to actants?

                      iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                      iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                      iris_meredith@mastodon.social
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #16

                      @AndyDearden
                      I've not read a terrible amount of Latour, but definitely worth a thought.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                        bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                        bignose@fosstodon.org
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #17

                        @voltagex has left me no option, I have to repeat one of my favourites:

                        “What part of “gestalt” don't you understand?”

                        i'll see myself out, thanks

                        @iris_meredith

                        1 Reply Last reply
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                        • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                          New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                          https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                          bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                          bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                          bignose@fosstodon.org
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #18

                          Thank you @iris_meredith, this is very timely given this week's terrible resolution by the #Debian project (to explicitly take no stand against any of the harms of #LLM “just a tool”).

                          I fervently wish that this was understood by more of the people voting in that resolution. The fight continues, I hope.

                          bignose@fosstodon.orgB 1 Reply Last reply
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                          • bignose@fosstodon.orgB bignose@fosstodon.org

                            Thank you @iris_meredith, this is very timely given this week's terrible resolution by the #Debian project (to explicitly take no stand against any of the harms of #LLM “just a tool”).

                            I fervently wish that this was understood by more of the people voting in that resolution. The fight continues, I hope.

                            bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                            bignose@fosstodon.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                            bignose@fosstodon.org
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #19

                            in case someone doesn't know what I'm referring to: this resolution https://www.debian.org/vote/2026/vote_002 was decided this week.

                            @iris_meredith

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                            • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                              New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                              https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                              andres4ny@social.ridetrans.itA This user is from outside of this forum
                              andres4ny@social.ridetrans.itA This user is from outside of this forum
                              andres4ny@social.ridetrans.it
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #20

                              @iris_meredith This is the kind of thing I bookmark for later reference.

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                                New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                                https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                                diazona@techhub.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                diazona@techhub.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                diazona@techhub.social
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #21

                                @iris_meredith Interesting, although I don't think I agree with the premise of what "just a tool" means. (Or at least that's not the way I would use the phrase.) Still, there are some insightful points in there.

                                1 Reply Last reply
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                                • mrsbeanbag@ieji.deM mrsbeanbag@ieji.de

                                  @iris_meredith i have been thinking about this very claim lately, and my conclusion is that it isn't *even* a tool. a tool is something you control, and with practice, master. you don't control an LLM. you just sort of, ask it, and it obeys, more or less, according to its interpretation of what you asked for. that's not a tool, it's a servant.

                                  paco@infosec.exchangeP This user is from outside of this forum
                                  paco@infosec.exchangeP This user is from outside of this forum
                                  paco@infosec.exchange
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #22

                                  @mrsbeanbag I think the blog and the reasoning in it is really good. I’m going to use it in the future. But I also agree with you that LLMs really strain the definition of “tool”.

                                  The same person giving the same LLM the same exact input more than once to solve the same problem more than once will get 2 different outputs (probably similar, but not at all identical). That makes it a strange “tool,” indeed.

                                  And there’s so much cargo culting around just the right phrases to prevent this problem or that problem. People can develop expertise with a tool. But LLMs’ non-determinism limit the value of past experience with respect to future performance.

                                  @iris_meredith

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                                    New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                                    https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                                    elexia@catcatnya.comE This user is from outside of this forum
                                    elexia@catcatnya.comE This user is from outside of this forum
                                    elexia@catcatnya.com
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #23

                                    @iris_meredith this isn't really gonna make us feel different about LLMs (which we don't and don't intend to use) but it is making us more seriously consider the implications of having a gun (which we currently do not but have wanted to, it just wasn't enough of a priority and financially unviable). while it's certainly not a new idea that carrying one does influence the wielder, we should consider that simply being aware of it doesn't make us immune to such influence. not that we would be allowed to carry a gun here anyway.

                                    iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI 1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • elexia@catcatnya.comE elexia@catcatnya.com

                                      @iris_meredith this isn't really gonna make us feel different about LLMs (which we don't and don't intend to use) but it is making us more seriously consider the implications of having a gun (which we currently do not but have wanted to, it just wasn't enough of a priority and financially unviable). while it's certainly not a new idea that carrying one does influence the wielder, we should consider that simply being aware of it doesn't make us immune to such influence. not that we would be allowed to carry a gun here anyway.

                                      iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                      iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                      iris_meredith@mastodon.social
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #24

                                      @elexia
                                      Honestly, the biggest worry I have with guns is the propensity we have to use them on ourselves. I know quite a few gun owners (who universally are very careful with that influence), and that's consistently my biggest fear.

                                      elexia@catcatnya.comE 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                                        @elexia
                                        Honestly, the biggest worry I have with guns is the propensity we have to use them on ourselves. I know quite a few gun owners (who universally are very careful with that influence), and that's consistently my biggest fear.

                                        elexia@catcatnya.comE This user is from outside of this forum
                                        elexia@catcatnya.comE This user is from outside of this forum
                                        elexia@catcatnya.com
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #25

                                        @iris_meredith yeah that's true.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • iris_meredith@mastodon.socialI iris_meredith@mastodon.social

                                          New article: this time, we use Heidegger to explain why the "it's just a tool" line that often comes up in tech is so very silly:

                                          https://deadsimpletech.com/blog/no-such-thing-as-just-a-tool

                                          bortzmeyer@mastodon.gougere.frB This user is from outside of this forum
                                          bortzmeyer@mastodon.gougere.frB This user is from outside of this forum
                                          bortzmeyer@mastodon.gougere.fr
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #26

                                          @iris_meredith I remember when I discovered (indeed, at a sichuanese restaurant) that you are not supposed to eat all the chili 🙂

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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