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  3. Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

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  • petealexharris@mastodon.scotP petealexharris@mastodon.scot

    @johncarlosbaez @marshray

    Maybe every time we met another group of humans or other hominins who thought differently about the world, negotiations with them were complicated.

    marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
    marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
    marshray@infosec.exchange
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #22

    @petealexharris @johncarlosbaez It does seem to fit right there at the dawn of “using language to coordinate with people other than those you share food with every day”.

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    • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

      Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

      So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

      maxpool@mathstodon.xyzM This user is from outside of this forum
      maxpool@mathstodon.xyzM This user is from outside of this forum
      maxpool@mathstodon.xyz
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #23

      @johncarlosbaez

      Having actual mastery (deep integrated understanding or skill) without effort would be great.

      Delegated mastery is just another word for having helpers, or using a tool. You can buy mastery of others and tools, but you can't buy the judgment that comes from deep understanding.

      That's why AI supercharges subject matter experts, but can cripple novices. It's a great junior assistant, but needs someone with judgement to boss it around.

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      • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

        Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

        So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

        mansr@society.oftrolls.comM This user is from outside of this forum
        mansr@society.oftrolls.comM This user is from outside of this forum
        mansr@society.oftrolls.com
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #24

        @johncarlosbaez Bring on the hellhounds.

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        • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

          Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

          So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

          chroma@raccoonisland.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
          chroma@raccoonisland.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
          chroma@raccoonisland.social
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #25

          @johncarlosbaez It's a very elegant way to say “weakness and incompetence are the source of all evil”.

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          • marshray@infosec.exchangeM marshray@infosec.exchange

            @petealexharris @johncarlosbaez I do find it really interesting that this idea of a uniquely capable yet maliciously compliant non-human entity is one of our ancient and universal cross cultural archetypes.

            robotistry@fediscience.orgR This user is from outside of this forum
            robotistry@fediscience.orgR This user is from outside of this forum
            robotistry@fediscience.org
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #26

            @marshray @petealexharris @johncarlosbaez
            I think it's built into humanity.

            We are aware of malice because it is a common failure mode in cooperative endeavours, especially in childhood when people have not learned to manage strong emotions like jealousy.

            Humans develop internal complex predictive models of not only their environment in general but of the behavior of other humans. We default to modeling others at our own level of competence.

            Which makes modeling toddlers extra hard, because we desperately need to model them, but they are nowhere near our level of competence.

            Both toddlers and robots often seem "maliciously compliant". They do *precisely* what you ask, especially when that's not what you intended.

            Of course all humanity has maliciously compliant trickster legends. Anyone with children would love those stories.

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            • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

              Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

              So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

              eivind@mastodon.fjerland.noE This user is from outside of this forum
              eivind@mastodon.fjerland.noE This user is from outside of this forum
              eivind@mastodon.fjerland.no
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #27

              @johncarlosbaez Agree. AI is indeed the demon being summoned, but all it gives you in return, is unsurpassed crap.

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              • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

                So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

                aronowski@furry.engineerA This user is from outside of this forum
                aronowski@furry.engineerA This user is from outside of this forum
                aronowski@furry.engineer
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #28

                @johncarlosbaez Relevant: https://furry.engineer/@aronowski/116486886171382391

                johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ 1 Reply Last reply
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                • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                  johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                  johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #29

                  @Beggarmidas - everything is more complicated than what anyone says, but I really do sense a line of tradition running from medieval magic to many people's attraction to AI. I wrote about it earlier here:

                  https://mathstodon.xyz/@johncarlosbaez/116855445718992437

                  How are your fertile inspirations coming to life? With work you can create something solid, but I get one or two emails a day from people trying to invent new theories of physics with the help of AI... almost all of which are nonsense, because they don't know enough physics.

                  climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                    @Beggarmidas - everything is more complicated than what anyone says, but I really do sense a line of tradition running from medieval magic to many people's attraction to AI. I wrote about it earlier here:

                    https://mathstodon.xyz/@johncarlosbaez/116855445718992437

                    How are your fertile inspirations coming to life? With work you can create something solid, but I get one or two emails a day from people trying to invent new theories of physics with the help of AI... almost all of which are nonsense, because they don't know enough physics.

                    climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                    climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                    climatejenny@biodiversity.social
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #30

                    @johncarlosbaez @Beggarmidas

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                    • aronowski@furry.engineerA aronowski@furry.engineer

                      @johncarlosbaez Relevant: https://furry.engineer/@aronowski/116486886171382391

                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #31

                      @aronowski - exactly right!

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                      • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                        Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

                        So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

                        mewsleah@meow.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        mewsleah@meow.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        mewsleah@meow.social
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #32

                        @johncarlosbaez i love the snark!

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                        • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                          Realizing more and more how modern-day AI taps into some very old urges.

                          So many would like "unsurpassed mastery without any effort", and would summon a demon to get it.

                          wizbean@tech.lgbtW This user is from outside of this forum
                          wizbean@tech.lgbtW This user is from outside of this forum
                          wizbean@tech.lgbt
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #33

                          @johncarlosbaez they are so low effort that they will summon a demon and sacrifice humanity to it, just to get slightly-below-average mastery in the arts and sciences

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                          • bogwitch@social.data.coopB bogwitch@social.data.coop shared this topic
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