Even when you try to use chatGPT like a dry research tool it will preferentially generate text that contains statements to affirm your feelings.
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@futurebird It definitely is luxury; I pay to have ad free services. I can afford it, but many cannot.
@starlily @futurebird I can afford to buy subscriptions to adfree experience and even then the platform shows ads and when i use an adblocker, i get banned. So it has become much easier to just stop using those services and returning to reading the classics
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@Epic_Null @futurebird Not wrong. I watch enough YT content that paying for it to remove ads is worthwhile, but any creator of any size is now forced to have "in-content promotion" that of course isnt blocked in any way other than the fast forward button.
@starlily @Epic_Null @futurebird with the recent lawsuit on YouTube, maybe they will integrate sponsorblock
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@futurebird I keep hearing people refer to it as "he" and it really bugs me, such a dangerous mental framing
@paulcox @futurebird a local artist shared some screenshots of quotes from an LLM doing a cutesy funny psychoanalysis of them, so delighted withvits 'accurate' summary of them.
They gave it a human name (forget what). Ugh.
I didn't comment on its access to their data and the Barnum effect, but unfollowed. It's a bit depressing to watch people embrace this garbage. -
I'll say one more thing, if the text generator has eased you into talking with it like it's a person. If it's felt easy to use and helpful, or if it has cheered you up with a compliment don't beat yourself up about that too much, but please do notice that it's happening.
It's like commercial with a beautiful person who makes you wish you could be like them. Or a salesman who compliments you. That's all this is.
What is it doing in the coding, research, work tool?
Great question.
RE: https://dair-community.social/@emilymbender/117128667664658202
@futurebird you probably already read this, but just in case:
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Skipping and doing your best to ignore is a good start. But they still influence us in ways we can't anticipate.
I have zero use for a giant pickup truck, I can't afford one, and I still want one. I'm angry at myself for wanting one, and I desperately hope I'm too smart to ever buy one. But no matter how smart I think I am, it's clear that ten thousand commercials with Bob Seger's music and Sam Elliott's voice and absurd fantasy rugged individuals has sunk hooks into me that I can't dislodge.
The real solution is ad-blockers of every possible kind and as much as it's practical (it often isn't), avoiding environments that contain ads.
@firebreathingduck @petealexharris @futurebird and ad-blocking is going to be much more difficult as ads have evolved from past's flashy banners, to more recent's dummy "pretend search results", to nowadays' "helpful" chatbots trying to nudge you into using some specific service/platform/shop.
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@firebreathingduck @petealexharris @futurebird and ad-blocking is going to be much more difficult as ads have evolved from past's flashy banners, to more recent's dummy "pretend search results", to nowadays' "helpful" chatbots trying to nudge you into using some specific service/platform/shop.
@dryak @firebreathingduck @futurebird
Ads are always detectable by an ad blocker, because like spam email they have essential characteristics: without trying to sell you something or redirect you to another page to do so (via a tracking link to record the redirect and charge the ad customer for it) they wouldn't be doing what the ad customer or ad company wants. Detectable and blockable. -
@dryak @firebreathingduck @futurebird
Ads are always detectable by an ad blocker, because like spam email they have essential characteristics: without trying to sell you something or redirect you to another page to do so (via a tracking link to record the redirect and charge the ad customer for it) they wouldn't be doing what the ad customer or ad company wants. Detectable and blockable.@petealexharris @firebreathingduck @futurebird You're thinking of old school "click here to buy" ads or sponsor links to the tools and a materials in a tutorial.
I am more thinking of: coding agents adresses a complex automation task by writing a collection of github actions. If this happens on a private repo, the runners that will execute those will be paid and bring money in to Microsoft Azure.
[...]
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@dryak @firebreathingduck @futurebird
Sure people are going to be doing a lot of things with clusters of word-guessing machines that don't make any commercial sense. I don't think it's relevant to whether humans or ad blockers can detect and remove ads directed at humans on web pages humans are looking at. -
@Epic_Null @futurebird Not wrong. I watch enough YT content that paying for it to remove ads is worthwhile, but any creator of any size is now forced to have "in-content promotion" that of course isnt blocked in any way other than the fast forward button.
@starlily @Epic_Null @futurebird i can rec invidious for watching youtube without ads and tracking
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@futurebird It definitely is luxury; I pay to have ad free services. I can afford it, but many cannot.
@starlily @futurebird Eventually the internet will be nothing but ads served to people who can't afford to avoid them (and therefore to buy anything).
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@futurebird @starlily @ahimsa_pdx
In the rare times that I encounter the web without an adblocker I am appalled. I just cannot believe anyone uses the damn thing without one. (But I am also one of those logophobic Gen Xers who removes or covers the branding on things I own, whenever possible without destroying them.)
@Voline @futurebird @starlily @ahimsa_pdx sigh, same
... or not buy.
There's this particular bicycle stem cap that I really liked - elegant shape, awesome typeface, with "ride more, worry less" motto that I really wanted on my bicycle.
But I didn't get it because it has the manufacturer logo on it too; not ugly, similar style, just... not the fucking point of why I want this stem cap in the first place.
Like, I don't want to brainwipe the company name (with which I have no ire or anything) from that motto whenever I read it. Just fucking no.
(if anyone from Acros happens to read this: you're doing it wrong)
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Living in a world without ads is a big part of what I think of as luxury if that makes any sense?
Listen, we are never going to get a big feature in The Atlantic or The New Yorker about how healthy, mentally freeing, and spiritually grounding it can be to purge all advertisements from your life, or about how so often this is impossible. (Dear reader can you infer why this will never happen?)
But, maybe we can start a stealth campaign of our own. What is freedom? No ads.
@futurebird @starlily Absolutely. I don't claim to be immune, but I'm less worried about the power of subtly targeted ads than about the endless firehose we must endure.
That said, many people simultaneously complain about paywalls AND ads. What's a reasonable model where creators (e.g. journalists) can be paid for their work?
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@futurebird @starlily Absolutely. I don't claim to be immune, but I'm less worried about the power of subtly targeted ads than about the endless firehose we must endure.
That said, many people simultaneously complain about paywalls AND ads. What's a reasonable model where creators (e.g. journalists) can be paid for their work?
I think supporting creators means creating an ecosystem of social media, media sharing sites and payment methods where generated content is unwelcome. Where ads are unwelcome and user support is expected so that people with less disposable income also have access to this kind of content.
In the long run this should have more formal institutional support through libraries and schools. In the short run we need to pay for more than just ourselves.
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I think supporting creators means creating an ecosystem of social media, media sharing sites and payment methods where generated content is unwelcome. Where ads are unwelcome and user support is expected so that people with less disposable income also have access to this kind of content.
In the long run this should have more formal institutional support through libraries and schools. In the short run we need to pay for more than just ourselves.
Where my patience runs thin is when I encounter people who have enough money to pay for cable TV, for Amazon Prime, Hulu, etc. but they balk at the idea of sending a creator $5 twice a year.
Most people spend $100s of dollars on media a year. If all of it is going to these big companies I think that's a huge mistake.
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I think supporting creators means creating an ecosystem of social media, media sharing sites and payment methods where generated content is unwelcome. Where ads are unwelcome and user support is expected so that people with less disposable income also have access to this kind of content.
In the long run this should have more formal institutional support through libraries and schools. In the short run we need to pay for more than just ourselves.
@futurebird @starlily Imagine a world where, AFTER you read something, there's an easy "tip" button. Maybe you hit it a couple of times if the thing was really good (or you are willing and able to pay more).
As we've seen, if you have to pay up front, there is a LOT of motivation to trick people with clickbait, slop, etc.
(continued)
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@futurebird @starlily Imagine a world where, AFTER you read something, there's an easy "tip" button. Maybe you hit it a couple of times if the thing was really good (or you are willing and able to pay more).
As we've seen, if you have to pay up front, there is a LOT of motivation to trick people with clickbait, slop, etc.
(continued)
@futurebird @starlily If users have to create an account and enter their payment info to give someone $1, they won't bother. Some might subscribe to bundles or services, but that way lies extractive middlemen.
Even if we solve these problems, will creators be able to make a living wage? How hard will they (have to?) beg for tips? How much will the model favor presenters who are appealing to the people with money?
Dennis Moore was right: This redistribution of wealth is tricky!
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I'll say one more thing, if the text generator has eased you into talking with it like it's a person. If it's felt easy to use and helpful, or if it has cheered you up with a compliment don't beat yourself up about that too much, but please do notice that it's happening.
It's like commercial with a beautiful person who makes you wish you could be like them. Or a salesman who compliments you. That's all this is.
What is it doing in the coding, research, work tool?
Great question.
@futurebird mostly yelling at it like it was a really annoying person, actually. (I know, it's not great either.)
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I don't pay for it. I want test it one more time in about two months. I has "improved" over the the year. It lists far more source links and makes fewer mistakes.
It still can't really save me much time, and not enough to pay for it at all since everything it spits out needs to be checked.
Were I more excited about it I'd feel the urgency to just block it right now.
@futurebird There’s no need to test the stochastic white supremacy parrot. Now, if we’re talking about testing the security measures at one of their data centers then get at me privately.
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@dryak @firebreathingduck @futurebird
Ads are always detectable by an ad blocker, because like spam email they have essential characteristics: without trying to sell you something or redirect you to another page to do so (via a tracking link to record the redirect and charge the ad customer for it) they wouldn't be doing what the ad customer or ad company wants. Detectable and blockable.@petealexharris @dryak @futurebird
There are countless billions of dollars at stake, so advertisers have become more sophisticated.
Look at all of the movies that feature people smoking cigarettes, because some tobacco company bribed the directors.
Search engines are putting sponsored results above accurate results without indicating that they’re doing so. The top item on the page might be “sponsored”, but the next few might be sponsored too. How would you know?
And of course if you shop at a physical store, the packaging of whatever you might buy is going to show strong or beautiful people in gorgeous settings with big smiles.
The radio station and music services play the sponsored songs more often when you select “random”.
etc… etc…
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Do, you notice it?
"can be frustrating"
I didn't say I was "frustrated" I just asked for more photos because most of the papers in the first response didn't have any.
HOWEVER, the guess that I was frustrated was correct. It even felt nice to read that some one else was having the same ... except wait.
There isn't anyone else!
I thought I'd share this to highlight just how deeply embedded these techniques are. Do you dislike being manipulated?
Please notice this.
@futurebird What an odd response. You asked a simple, straightforward question and instead of just giving you the answer it added a bunch of unnecessary emotional nonsense.
Power users say, “You can train it not to do that,” but we shouldn’t have to. It’s a freaking computer. If anything *shouldn’t* be reading things into simple questions it’s a computer!
The fact that ChatGPT’s programmers engineered it to act like a clingy ex doesn’t paint them in a good light.
