A brief sigh.
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I disagree.
No one should be an associate until they de-plutocratize their government.
The UK is broken.
Not US levels of broken, but it's still very broken.
Required them to clean house before getting into free trade agreements.
There are, indeed, fundamental problems at play here.
The EU should, obviously, be able to trust any agreement made with the UK, and that's probably one of the reasons why there's a lot of ground to be covered before a rejoin is possible.
I'm a baby steps kind of dude on this point.
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Personally, I don't think it's a question of muscle power as much as of attitude. It was quite dominant in the debate after the Brexit vote too. A sort of vague assumption that the EU would be better off with some British leadership. It wasn't seen as offensive or even as problematic, it was simply taken for granted. It's much more subdued now, but I still encounter it from time to time.
@SuneAuken @dannyreving It’s complex and yet very simple. A lot of British people appear ignorant of what ‘The’ Empire meant for most normal working class people, and also forget or don’t realise the extent of other empires. This stems from a piss-poor education with regard to subject matter.
For the last nearly 50 years we’ve also had politicians and media outlets preaching the worst of neo-liberal political/economic theory and that public-bad private-good with any social support being a drain, etc.
It means there’s a lot of exceptionalism around in the country and equality is for others. There’s a lot believe that Britain won World War II.
Quite frankly I’m amazed anyone wants us in their Union, even being pragmatic about things.
A bit of humble self-reflection amongst a large part of British society wouldn’t go amiss.
Love, Britain
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A brief sigh.
I sometimes still hear UK-rejoiners, with whom I otherwise heartily agree, repeat the phrase that the UK should be in the EU to lead it.
Please, please, please.
We don't need Britain to lead us. Nobody wants to be under Rule Britannia. It's not a good place to be.
We would love to have the UK as a partner on equal footing. Someone to cooperate with. A friend and ally; not a master.
@SuneAuken i used to agree, and am in favour of the EU, however i think England is too far gone, its politics is too far right wing, and it needs time to sort itself out.
However Scotland and Wales should join asap
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@SuneAuken @dannyreving It’s complex and yet very simple. A lot of British people appear ignorant of what ‘The’ Empire meant for most normal working class people, and also forget or don’t realise the extent of other empires. This stems from a piss-poor education with regard to subject matter.
For the last nearly 50 years we’ve also had politicians and media outlets preaching the worst of neo-liberal political/economic theory and that public-bad private-good with any social support being a drain, etc.
It means there’s a lot of exceptionalism around in the country and equality is for others. There’s a lot believe that Britain won World War II.
Quite frankly I’m amazed anyone wants us in their Union, even being pragmatic about things.
A bit of humble self-reflection amongst a large part of British society wouldn’t go amiss.
Love, BritainA very fine reflection. Thank you.
Seen from an EU-perspective:
Carney brilliantly remarked that the current US-adminstration signs its deals in pencil.
The brexit process gave evidence that the UK government at the time, BS Johnson in particular, of course, was all set to go to sign deals in pencil.
The EU needs a partner that signs in ink. It's getting better, but it'll take time.
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@SuneAuken i used to agree, and am in favour of the EU, however i think England is too far gone, its politics is too far right wing, and it needs time to sort itself out.
However Scotland and Wales should join asap
I can't cover everything in one post, but I do agree that the EU needs stable partners and that there's some way to go with English politics right now. I don't know Wales well enough to say anything competent, but Scotland does seem an obvious partner.
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A brief sigh.
I sometimes still hear UK-rejoiners, with whom I otherwise heartily agree, repeat the phrase that the UK should be in the EU to lead it.
Please, please, please.
We don't need Britain to lead us. Nobody wants to be under Rule Britannia. It's not a good place to be.
We would love to have the UK as a partner on equal footing. Someone to cooperate with. A friend and ally; not a master.
@SuneAuken I'm English
I don't want Britain to lead me let alone anyone else
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@SuneAuken I'm English
I don't want Britain to lead me let alone anyone else
Friends and allies!
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Friends and allies!
@SuneAuken Britain doesn't do "equal" very well unfortunately
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@SuneAuken Britain doesn't do "equal" very well unfortunately
I think that's fundamentally true and a large part of the underlying cause of Brexit in the first place.
It's also why there's a fairly long way back. The EU cannot work if the members aren't fundamentally equal.
However, it's also worth noting that almost all steps on the way back are worth taking in their own right.
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I think that's fundamentally true and a large part of the underlying cause of Brexit in the first place.
It's also why there's a fairly long way back. The EU cannot work if the members aren't fundamentally equal.
However, it's also worth noting that almost all steps on the way back are worth taking in their own right.
@SuneAuken You're preaching to the choir
The number of people I screamed at who just wanted to give Cameron a bloody nose saying "It's only advisory, they'll never do it"
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@SuneAuken You're preaching to the choir
The number of people I screamed at who just wanted to give Cameron a bloody nose saying "It's only advisory, they'll never do it"
Us cheerleaders are, by nature, preaching to the choir.
Oh I can SO feel the frustration of those screams.
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S suneauken@mastodon.world shared this topic
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Us cheerleaders are, by nature, preaching to the choir.
Oh I can SO feel the frustration of those screams.
@SuneAuken It was obvious that the Elite wanted us out of the EU or they would have found an excuse not to have the referendum
Rule 1 in politics is "Unless you have no option, you don't ask the people a question unless you know what the answer will be"
They just wanted an excuse & the "Bloody Nose Brigade" gave it to them
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A brief sigh.
I sometimes still hear UK-rejoiners, with whom I otherwise heartily agree, repeat the phrase that the UK should be in the EU to lead it.
Please, please, please.
We don't need Britain to lead us. Nobody wants to be under Rule Britannia. It's not a good place to be.
We would love to have the UK as a partner on equal footing. Someone to cooperate with. A friend and ally; not a master.
@SuneAuken exactly what we want in Scotland
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@SuneAuken exactly what we want in Scotland
Speaking just for me, I'd love to have you.
