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  3. Something I often thought about when I was poor is how expensive it is to be poor.

Something I often thought about when I was poor is how expensive it is to be poor.

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bootstheoryexpensivetobepo
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  • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

    If you've never experienced it, I think it is difficult to understand the logic. Since I got enough money to make better decisions, I could immediately feel the effects on my psyche. I save up money now - I have savings. Which I've never had before and feel so joyous and proud about. That means I can "invest" my money (a whole new way of thinking), that is, make better economic decision. Living suddenly becomes cheaper, because I can afford the right decisions. This is the crazy part for me.

    malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
    malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
    malte@radikal.social
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #3

    To my surprise, there's a "theory" or about this, called the Sam Vimes theory of socioeconomic unfairness or simply Boots theory. Terry Pratchet came up with this in one of his fantasy novels. The theory is basically that "people in poverty have to buy cheap and subpar products that need to be replaced repeatedly, proving more expensive in the long run than more expensive items." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory

    malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

      To my surprise, there's a "theory" or about this, called the Sam Vimes theory of socioeconomic unfairness or simply Boots theory. Terry Pratchet came up with this in one of his fantasy novels. The theory is basically that "people in poverty have to buy cheap and subpar products that need to be replaced repeatedly, proving more expensive in the long run than more expensive items." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory

      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
      malte@radikal.social
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #4

      Looking back on the footwear I've had over the years, I've had lots of bad quality, but I'm happy that I've taken pretty good care of my shoes and boots regardless. Most have stayed with me for years before breaking apart, some are still with me since 2013 and 2016. Not having money can teach you frugality, and I will take that with me. Now that I have enough money to buy good quality footwear, I want to have shit that will last for decades, can be resoled etc.

      malte@radikal.socialM siggi@radikal.socialS 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

        Looking back on the footwear I've had over the years, I've had lots of bad quality, but I'm happy that I've taken pretty good care of my shoes and boots regardless. Most have stayed with me for years before breaking apart, some are still with me since 2013 and 2016. Not having money can teach you frugality, and I will take that with me. Now that I have enough money to buy good quality footwear, I want to have shit that will last for decades, can be resoled etc.

        malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
        malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
        malte@radikal.social
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #5

        The wider morale of this story is of course that the unfairness in Boots theory is also why we will continue to be doomed as far as the ecological crisis goes unless we turn the economic order upside-down. We're all paying the price for fast fashion and all the other bad ecological decisions being made today, because people can't afford to make the right ones. This is the ultimate injustice and a strong reason for climate justice to be center of the agenda.

        malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

          If you've never experienced it, I think it is difficult to understand the logic. Since I got enough money to make better decisions, I could immediately feel the effects on my psyche. I save up money now - I have savings. Which I've never had before and feel so joyous and proud about. That means I can "invest" my money (a whole new way of thinking), that is, make better economic decision. Living suddenly becomes cheaper, because I can afford the right decisions. This is the crazy part for me.

          mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
          mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
          mikejackmin@liberdon.com
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #6

          @malte

          money is a tool

          use the tool to help yourself - boots that last, an education, reliable transportation, a financial buffer, moving to a place with better jobs

          use it to make yourself more productive, minimize risk, and create opportunity

          don't spend it, invest it in yourself. food and shelter are investments

          cheap boots can be wise, if they leave you with more to invest, in more productive things. id rather have cheap boots and cheap gloves then great boots and no gloves

          mikejackmin@liberdon.comM 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • mikejackmin@liberdon.comM mikejackmin@liberdon.com

            @malte

            money is a tool

            use the tool to help yourself - boots that last, an education, reliable transportation, a financial buffer, moving to a place with better jobs

            use it to make yourself more productive, minimize risk, and create opportunity

            don't spend it, invest it in yourself. food and shelter are investments

            cheap boots can be wise, if they leave you with more to invest, in more productive things. id rather have cheap boots and cheap gloves then great boots and no gloves

            mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
            mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
            mikejackmin@liberdon.com
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #7

            @malte

            the cheap boots are not a problem, or a cause of trouble, they can be the smartest choice at the time

            ask yourself what you would do if you needed to double your income. what new skill, new permit, new location, new degree would it take? write it down

            a specific target is a goal. a goal with a date attached is a plan

            malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • mikejackmin@liberdon.comM mikejackmin@liberdon.com

              @malte

              the cheap boots are not a problem, or a cause of trouble, they can be the smartest choice at the time

              ask yourself what you would do if you needed to double your income. what new skill, new permit, new location, new degree would it take? write it down

              a specific target is a goal. a goal with a date attached is a plan

              malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
              malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
              malte@radikal.social
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #8

              @mikejackmin What you're saying seems vaguely coherent but at the same time a bit nonsensical.

              mikejackmin@liberdon.comM 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                @mikejackmin What you're saying seems vaguely coherent but at the same time a bit nonsensical.

                mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                mikejackmin@liberdon.com
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #9

                @malte

                it might be me. usually it's me

                just to clarify, im not saying it's fair, and i'm not even saying it will work, it's just a way to understand how the idea of investment applies to your personal life

                imagine you were stranded on a deserted island. you have limited energy, and the clock is ticking

                find water first, then make shelter, then find food, then do the next thing, and the next, each step making yourself safer. its just how to survive

                mikejackmin@liberdon.comM 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • mikejackmin@liberdon.comM mikejackmin@liberdon.com

                  @malte

                  it might be me. usually it's me

                  just to clarify, im not saying it's fair, and i'm not even saying it will work, it's just a way to understand how the idea of investment applies to your personal life

                  imagine you were stranded on a deserted island. you have limited energy, and the clock is ticking

                  find water first, then make shelter, then find food, then do the next thing, and the next, each step making yourself safer. its just how to survive

                  mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                  mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                  mikejackmin@liberdon.com
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #10

                  @malte

                  somebody comes by and sees you drinking water out of a stream with your hands. you need a cup! you're wasting energy and time

                  no, im investing my energy in more important things. ill make a cup when it becomes the most important thing. right now, using my hands is smart

                  mikejackmin@liberdon.comM 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • mikejackmin@liberdon.comM mikejackmin@liberdon.com

                    @malte

                    somebody comes by and sees you drinking water out of a stream with your hands. you need a cup! you're wasting energy and time

                    no, im investing my energy in more important things. ill make a cup when it becomes the most important thing. right now, using my hands is smart

                    mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                    mikejackmin@liberdon.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                    mikejackmin@liberdon.com
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #11

                    @malte

                    its not the boots, its not the cup

                    do the most productive thing first

                    malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • mikejackmin@liberdon.comM mikejackmin@liberdon.com

                      @malte

                      its not the boots, its not the cup

                      do the most productive thing first

                      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                      malte@radikal.social
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #12

                      @mikejackmin Since you're speaking in the imperative, you're message comes across as advice. You're writing to me, after all. At the same time there's little indication that you've listened to my story. Hence why it seems a bit nonsensical. I'm close to repeating myself, so if I get a new round of free association, I'll not respond to it, but put some music to it and imagine it's economic religion turned into a performance piece.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                        Looking back on the footwear I've had over the years, I've had lots of bad quality, but I'm happy that I've taken pretty good care of my shoes and boots regardless. Most have stayed with me for years before breaking apart, some are still with me since 2013 and 2016. Not having money can teach you frugality, and I will take that with me. Now that I have enough money to buy good quality footwear, I want to have shit that will last for decades, can be resoled etc.

                        siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                        siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                        siggi@radikal.social
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #13

                        @malte Where will you buy lasting footwear in Copenhagen to day?

                        malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • siggi@radikal.socialS siggi@radikal.social

                          @malte Where will you buy lasting footwear in Copenhagen to day?

                          malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                          malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                          malte@radikal.social
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #14

                          @siggi I've had good experiences in shops that deal in traditional work wear like Brund and Motorious. You can get quality leather footwear with properly stitched soles plus advice to take good care of your shoes or boots. Some of their customers obsess about the aesthetics of long-worn footwear or denim which can seem a bit, well, obsessive or just silly. But I have some sympathy. It's probably thanks to "denim heads" & other fanatics that the rest of us can still get lasting clothes.

                          siggi@radikal.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                            The wider morale of this story is of course that the unfairness in Boots theory is also why we will continue to be doomed as far as the ecological crisis goes unless we turn the economic order upside-down. We're all paying the price for fast fashion and all the other bad ecological decisions being made today, because people can't afford to make the right ones. This is the ultimate injustice and a strong reason for climate justice to be center of the agenda.

                            malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                            malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                            malte@radikal.social
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #15

                            Speaking of durable clothing, I was happy to explore knitwear brand Andersen-Andersen's store today. Read an interview with co-founder Cathrine Lundgren-Andersen. Consider how rare it is to hear a CEO of a clothing company say something like this: “The collection is actually complete now. That's a pretty wild thing to say in this world, where everything has to be renewed all the time. We don't have to do that ... we don't need to make any new models." https://heartbeats.dk/hun-ville-lave-verdens-bedste-soemandstroeje-nu-er-det-danske-toejmaerke-andersen-andersen-komplet (article in Danish)

                            malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                              Speaking of durable clothing, I was happy to explore knitwear brand Andersen-Andersen's store today. Read an interview with co-founder Cathrine Lundgren-Andersen. Consider how rare it is to hear a CEO of a clothing company say something like this: “The collection is actually complete now. That's a pretty wild thing to say in this world, where everything has to be renewed all the time. We don't have to do that ... we don't need to make any new models." https://heartbeats.dk/hun-ville-lave-verdens-bedste-soemandstroeje-nu-er-det-danske-toejmaerke-andersen-andersen-komplet (article in Danish)

                              malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                              malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                              malte@radikal.social
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #16

                              Some researchers are now describing Japan as a "low desire society", because people increasingly don't want things. If the Japanese developments in declining birthrates have taught us something, it is that they might be a few years ahead of the overdeveloped world. There's a sense of saturation and depression with the wasteful constant growth paradigm. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Koow0Q6EiXU

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                                @siggi I've had good experiences in shops that deal in traditional work wear like Brund and Motorious. You can get quality leather footwear with properly stitched soles plus advice to take good care of your shoes or boots. Some of their customers obsess about the aesthetics of long-worn footwear or denim which can seem a bit, well, obsessive or just silly. But I have some sympathy. It's probably thanks to "denim heads" & other fanatics that the rest of us can still get lasting clothes.

                                siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                                siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                                siggi@radikal.social
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #17

                                @malte thanks. Will tjeck the shops out. What kind of shoes do you use in to make garden work in?

                                malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • siggi@radikal.socialS siggi@radikal.social

                                  @malte thanks. Will tjeck the shops out. What kind of shoes do you use in to make garden work in?

                                  malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                  malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                  malte@radikal.social
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #18

                                  @siggi I've used different types of Chelsea boots made for work over the years - variously called "Australian work boot" or Dealer boots. I like that they're slip-on (with goring instead of laces) and pull tabs, to go in and out of the house. The problem is that most of them have glued on soles, which makes them cheaper to make, but difficult to resole. I'm trying to resole a pair for the second time now and the cobbler couldn't guarantee that he could repair them.

                                  malte@radikal.socialM siggi@radikal.socialS 2 Replies Last reply
                                  1
                                  0
                                  • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                                    @siggi I've used different types of Chelsea boots made for work over the years - variously called "Australian work boot" or Dealer boots. I like that they're slip-on (with goring instead of laces) and pull tabs, to go in and out of the house. The problem is that most of them have glued on soles, which makes them cheaper to make, but difficult to resole. I'm trying to resole a pair for the second time now and the cobbler couldn't guarantee that he could repair them.

                                    malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    malte@radikal.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #19

                                    @siggi I wanted to get boots with stitched or welted sole, that could more easily be repaired later. I decided laces are OK, because the gardening work I do now is often many hours in a row without me needing to get boots on and off. I wanted flat soles (wedge soles) without too much pattern, because they tend to get really heavy when mud builds up. I also didn't want to buy online, so I ended up getting one of Red Wings Moc Toes, because they ticked all the boxes.

                                    malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                                      @siggi I wanted to get boots with stitched or welted sole, that could more easily be repaired later. I decided laces are OK, because the gardening work I do now is often many hours in a row without me needing to get boots on and off. I wanted flat soles (wedge soles) without too much pattern, because they tend to get really heavy when mud builds up. I also didn't want to buy online, so I ended up getting one of Red Wings Moc Toes, because they ticked all the boxes.

                                      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      malte@radikal.social
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #20

                                      @siggi For people that garden more casually, I think Chelsea work boots are still a great option, because you can slip them on easily and go garden for half an hour or even lots of hours (most of my colleagues use this style of boot). Just make sure to get a boot that has a welted, not glued sole. If I were to get a pair today, I would probably go look for a store - perhaps even make a small trip to get to one - and try the ones made by French producer Gatine https://chaussuresdegatine.fr/produit/rungis/

                                      malte@radikal.socialM 2 Replies Last reply
                                      0
                                      • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                                        @siggi For people that garden more casually, I think Chelsea work boots are still a great option, because you can slip them on easily and go garden for half an hour or even lots of hours (most of my colleagues use this style of boot). Just make sure to get a boot that has a welted, not glued sole. If I were to get a pair today, I would probably go look for a store - perhaps even make a small trip to get to one - and try the ones made by French producer Gatine https://chaussuresdegatine.fr/produit/rungis/

                                        malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        malte@radikal.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        malte@radikal.social
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #21

                                        @siggi Some other brands I've noted down from further away: Jim Green Stockmans (from SA) https://jimgreenfootwear.com/store/stockman-f3b

                                        malte@radikal.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • malte@radikal.socialM malte@radikal.social

                                          @siggi I've used different types of Chelsea boots made for work over the years - variously called "Australian work boot" or Dealer boots. I like that they're slip-on (with goring instead of laces) and pull tabs, to go in and out of the house. The problem is that most of them have glued on soles, which makes them cheaper to make, but difficult to resole. I'm trying to resole a pair for the second time now and the cobbler couldn't guarantee that he could repair them.

                                          siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                                          siggi@radikal.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                                          siggi@radikal.social
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af siggi@radikal.social
                                          #22

                                          @malte ahh, yes. In my previous work I had one of those with a steal nose as my work shoes. Will try to finds some with stiched soles.

                                          Thanks for great advise!

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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