One of my favourite spinning/yarn facts.
-
One of my favourite spinning/yarn facts.
Almost all of your ancestors could spin.
There was a tiny fragment of Neanderthal yarn/twine found in France. It's made from the bast from tree bark......
It's at least 40,000 years old....
It's bloody three ply lace weight yarn. I doubt ANY modern spinner could pull that off, even with all our gadgets and knowledge.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/04/neanderthals-made-the-worlds-oldest-thread/
@dar Love the Closing sentence: "Neanderthals were a long way from inventing algebra, but they obviously had a great grasp of string theory"
-
@FanCityKnits Lolerscates!
Yeah.... process the bast from a conifer tree then spin it into a three ply laceweight..... I will be cheering you on all the way.... and seriously doubting you/anyone could do it.
I won't even ask you to use a stone and a stick. You can use whatever you like.
@dar @FanCityKnits i don’t prepare much bast fiber by hand, but I have absolutely spun that type of yarn from flax. Not often and only samples as it’s not practical for the things I make with yarn. It’s also not easy to find suitably prepared flax. For a while people were buying vintage fiber from Swedish estate sales. And it’s much easier to find flax than many of the other traditional bast fibers.
Here’s the abstract for a paper about fiber from linden trees: https://www.academia.edu/50044881/History_manufacture_and_properties_of_lime_bast_cordage_in_northern_Europe
-
@dar @FanCityKnits i don’t prepare much bast fiber by hand, but I have absolutely spun that type of yarn from flax. Not often and only samples as it’s not practical for the things I make with yarn. It’s also not easy to find suitably prepared flax. For a while people were buying vintage fiber from Swedish estate sales. And it’s much easier to find flax than many of the other traditional bast fibers.
Here’s the abstract for a paper about fiber from linden trees: https://www.academia.edu/50044881/History_manufacture_and_properties_of_lime_bast_cordage_in_northern_Europe
That's kind of my point though. Flax has been bred for over 30,000 years to have very good properties for processing for spinning.... and it is still seen as a top spinning skill.
That was made from the bark of a conifer 40,000 years ago with no complex tools, and they still span it better than either me or thee could.
-
@dar @FanCityKnits i don’t prepare much bast fiber by hand, but I have absolutely spun that type of yarn from flax. Not often and only samples as it’s not practical for the things I make with yarn. It’s also not easy to find suitably prepared flax. For a while people were buying vintage fiber from Swedish estate sales. And it’s much easier to find flax than many of the other traditional bast fibers.
Here’s the abstract for a paper about fiber from linden trees: https://www.academia.edu/50044881/History_manufacture_and_properties_of_lime_bast_cordage_in_northern_Europe
-
That level of skill doesn’t just happen in one individual in one generation.
It’s not just the math of sets and patterns, it’s the sharing of algorithms.
Anyone who spins, weaves, knits or crochets has an intuitive grasp of what eventually became encoded as machine language.
In fact, it means that they could develop and teach those machine language-like algorithms to others over generations.
That says a great deal about Neanderthal language skills. It doesn’t really matter whether they were verbal, sign or a mix of the two.
#FibreCrafts #Spinning #Archeology #MachineLanguage #Computing #Yarn
Heh. The art of programming would then re-appear with Jacquard and his loom.
-
@dar
Mind blown!!
3ply lace that's 0.5mm thick? By hand??? -
That's kind of my point though. Flax has been bred for over 30,000 years to have very good properties for processing for spinning.... and it is still seen as a top spinning skill.
That was made from the bark of a conifer 40,000 years ago with no complex tools, and they still span it better than either me or thee could.
@dar @FanCityKnits the only reason I don’t spin these fibers is I don’t have easy access to them. If I can figure out ponderosa pine or mullein that will absolutely be a thing.
Still, don’t underestimate modern hand spinners. There aren’t as many doing fine yarn but we are out there. It takes practice and not everybody has the time or patience for it.
Which fibers are thought “easy” is as much about one’s cultural background and familiarity as anything. Flax vs wool are distinct techniques.
-
@dar @FanCityKnits the only reason I don’t spin these fibers is I don’t have easy access to them. If I can figure out ponderosa pine or mullein that will absolutely be a thing.
Still, don’t underestimate modern hand spinners. There aren’t as many doing fine yarn but we are out there. It takes practice and not everybody has the time or patience for it.
Which fibers are thought “easy” is as much about one’s cultural background and familiarity as anything. Flax vs wool are distinct techniques.
@dar @FanCityKnits spinners I know who grew up with cotton can struggle with wool at first. Also different techniques.
Prep methods aside, I’ve found the spinning is more about what you are used to.
After a few decades at it, I’m pretty confident my skill with my usual fibers is absolute comparable with historic textiles. Other fibers just take me a bit longer
-
@tuban_muzuru @CleoQc theres about 30,000 years between that scrap of yarn and these spindle whorls.
-
@dar @FanCityKnits spinners I know who grew up with cotton can struggle with wool at first. Also different techniques.
Prep methods aside, I’ve found the spinning is more about what you are used to.
After a few decades at it, I’m pretty confident my skill with my usual fibers is absolute comparable with historic textiles. Other fibers just take me a bit longer
@dar @FanCityKnits it’s a shame we are losing all these skills. As someone who can and does make textiles by hand, the quality of many commercial textiles makes me sad. Another reason I try to share what I know.
-
@tuban_muzuru @CleoQc theres about 30,000 years between that scrap of yarn and these spindle whorls.
-
@dar @FanCityKnits it’s a shame we are losing all these skills. As someone who can and does make textiles by hand, the quality of many commercial textiles makes me sad. Another reason I try to share what I know.
@dar @FanCityKnits since we are on the subject, what sorts of textiles do you make?
Today I met someone wearing a clearly handwoven scarf. I said “i love your scarf, did you weave it?” They replied “Yes!” and so rarely does that happen.
-
@CleoQc The thing that gets me is the level of knowledge passed down before it was made.
Which tree species is best. How to recognise it. Where on the tree to harvest the good bits without killing it. How to process tree bark for its bast. And that's BEFORE you even think about the level of skill needed to make a laceweight 3 ply with only a sick and a stone. It's humbling, in a really good way.
@dar
I know, right??? So much knowledge required to make a 3 ply lace. Generations of trying things out, failing, and then figuring out better ways. -
I learned to process raw fleeces into yarn because about 20 or so years ago I started to feel that everything is going to go tits up. That feeling has only ever got stronger.
I have a few small skills as insurance against catastrophe... At least I can keep people warm and clothed.
Thanks for following me. :))
Spinning from raw fleece, I love that, just hard to get material here in central Germany, nobody shearing anymore..
Years ago I was the one on the spinning wheel, collected natural coloring agents and dyed the yarn.Still have a recipe collection for that.
I no longer have the spinning wheel but maybe I will make one again.
Often carry a self made spindle which I like using.In that long ago time my girlfriend was the weaver and knitter, sadly she moved on.
Pls. keep in touch
-
One of my favourite spinning/yarn facts.
Almost all of your ancestors could spin.
There was a tiny fragment of Neanderthal yarn/twine found in France. It's made from the bast from tree bark......
It's at least 40,000 years old....
It's bloody three ply lace weight yarn. I doubt ANY modern spinner could pull that off, even with all our gadgets and knowledge.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/04/neanderthals-made-the-worlds-oldest-thread/
Ruth Goodman talks a bit about how fast and steady her daughter is at the hand skills she learned really early (because she was with her mother doing experimental archaeology).
-
One of my favourite spinning/yarn facts.
Almost all of your ancestors could spin.
There was a tiny fragment of Neanderthal yarn/twine found in France. It's made from the bast from tree bark......
It's at least 40,000 years old....
It's bloody three ply lace weight yarn. I doubt ANY modern spinner could pull that off, even with all our gadgets and knowledge.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/04/neanderthals-made-the-worlds-oldest-thread/
@dar
Ah the arrogance of Modern humans -
J jwcph@helvede.net shared this topic
