I was a child living in West Germany in the late 70s and early 80s.
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@tofugolem @Gustodon I am acquainted with a number of republican folks. They are thrilled with how “well” things are going. As one of them recently told me, “the future is brighter than ever for America.”
@vpermar Those people have lost the thread.
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I was a child living in West Germany in the late 70s and early 80s.
I remember reading an interview with elderly Nazis and being shocked at how divorced from reality they still sounded. Their minds were still warped from propaganda viewed decades prior. The majority of their lives were lived without said propaganda, and they were still essentially insane.
US citizens need to understand this. Germany shows us what is going to happen.
Some of those Republicans will realize how wrong they…
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The solution to today’s times (here in Canada we have our own MapleMAGA) is not to somehow redeem the MAGA crowd, it’s to provide a vision and a path that convinces the half of the population that has been sitting on its hands to get up and be part of something better.
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…were, but many—if not most—are never going to get better. They will never become sane. They will never stop being evil. They will never stop being civilization-destroying savages. They will never be decent human beings.
People need to accept this.
All you can do is cut them out of your life.
I think the comparisons to cults and leaving religion are apt. Once an ideology attaches itself to one’s sense of self-worth, some simply cannot let go.
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I honestly think the most hopeful outcome for most of them is that they will move on to a different (but probably adjacent) cult that is less socially destructive, because the cultish patterns of thought do not go away easily.
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…were, but many—if not most—are never going to get better. They will never become sane. They will never stop being evil. They will never stop being civilization-destroying savages. They will never be decent human beings.
People need to accept this.
All you can do is cut them out of your life.
I think the comparisons to cults and leaving religion are apt. Once an ideology attaches itself to one’s sense of self-worth, some simply cannot let go.
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@tofugolem Having followed news about the occupation of Minneapolis, I was shocked recently to read about Evangelical churches like Cities Church welcoming it, seeing ICE as righteous men fighting degeneracy.
https://baptistnews.com/article/lets-talk-about-how-cities-church-treats-women/
It's easy to reach for Nazis as comparison. But the US has such a long lineage of weaponizing a particular version of Christianity to create all manner of abuses. Slavery, Indigenous genocide, Iraq invasion as a crusade by "God's chosen nation", etc. Its hard to imagine that ever really being reckoned with.
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Can you point me at something to read that will show me how the former Nazis were still delusional?
I think I agree that this is probably the case, but I'm morbidly curious about seeing an example. (Feel free to advise me not to follow up on that curiosity for the sake of my sanity.
@weekend_editor
I read the interview as a child in the late 70s or early 80s. I have no idea where to find a citation for that, nor am I interested in reading anymore interviews with elderly Nazis. -
@weekend_editor
I read the interview as a child in the late 70s or early 80s. I have no idea where to find a citation for that, nor am I interested in reading anymore interviews with elderly Nazis.Ok. No need to be re-traumatized (or bored)!
I'm fully capable of doing my own research.
I'm just curious about the persistence of cognitive injury from exposure to propaganda & disinformation, based on what seemed to be rapid personality changes I saw in people around COVID-19 vaccines, and now Trump.
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@tofugolem Having followed news about the occupation of Minneapolis, I was shocked recently to read about Evangelical churches like Cities Church welcoming it, seeing ICE as righteous men fighting degeneracy.
https://baptistnews.com/article/lets-talk-about-how-cities-church-treats-women/
It's easy to reach for Nazis as comparison. But the US has such a long lineage of weaponizing a particular version of Christianity to create all manner of abuses. Slavery, Indigenous genocide, Iraq invasion as a crusade by "God's chosen nation", etc. Its hard to imagine that ever really being reckoned with.
none of this would be possible without the Catholic Church's Doctrine of Discovery. nobody would care about the year 1492 if that was never a thing.
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Ok. No need to be re-traumatized (or bored)!
I'm fully capable of doing my own research.
I'm just curious about the persistence of cognitive injury from exposure to propaganda & disinformation, based on what seemed to be rapid personality changes I saw in people around COVID-19 vaccines, and now Trump.
Listen to NPR. Read the NYT.
Talk about brain damage from decades i”of propaganda.
American Liberals still believe that Liberalism defeats Nazism.
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none of this would be possible without the Catholic Church's Doctrine of Discovery. nobody would care about the year 1492 if that was never a thing.
@burnitdown @tofugolem Sure, doctrine of discovery gave moral license for plunder. I suppose I find it interesting to then compare/contrast settler colonialism between various countries. For example, Canada, US and Mexico all settled under doctrine of discovery by different European powers. Ireland and Israel/Palestine also subject to settler colonialism, but probably not doctrine of discovery?
The muscular/individualist/supremacist evangelical Calvinist protestantism does seem to have a uniquely American flavour to me. Though I find myself wondering about similarities with the Dutch Reformed church in South Africa.
I guess my point is that countries colonized under Doctrine of Discovery have many similar features. But it's not the sole explanatory factor.
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Can you point me at something to read that will show me how the former Nazis were still delusional?
I think I agree that this is probably the case, but I'm morbidly curious about seeing an example. (Feel free to advise me not to follow up on that curiosity for the sake of my sanity.
@weekend_editor @tofugolem https://holocaustcenter.jfcs.org/education-resources/ordinary-men/ is one such book (I haven’t read it though)
And then a nice article: We are Not "Good Germans"
While echoes with the 1930s abound, a closer look at how Germans failed to stop Hitler suggests that America's antibodies are much stronger.
By Micah L. Sifry -
@burnitdown @tofugolem Sure, doctrine of discovery gave moral license for plunder. I suppose I find it interesting to then compare/contrast settler colonialism between various countries. For example, Canada, US and Mexico all settled under doctrine of discovery by different European powers. Ireland and Israel/Palestine also subject to settler colonialism, but probably not doctrine of discovery?
The muscular/individualist/supremacist evangelical Calvinist protestantism does seem to have a uniquely American flavour to me. Though I find myself wondering about similarities with the Dutch Reformed church in South Africa.
I guess my point is that countries colonized under Doctrine of Discovery have many similar features. But it's not the sole explanatory factor.
it's all a result of the Doctrine of Discovery. the patterns are always the same. they even use one colonialism to do another colonialism. the RCMP are based on the Ulster constabulary, which the British established as an extremely brutal colonial police force in Ireland. the Ulster constabulary is the model for all modern police forces. Britain did that because of the Doctrine of Discovery.
it's not about this church or that church being slightly different, it's about the permission the Catholic Church gave to carry out the actions of colonialism. it is literally permission and direction to destroy entire cultures if they do not submit to the Church and recognise Jesus as their lord and saviour.
it's not an accident that Indigenous people of Turtle Island have only asked the Pope to apologise for and rescind the Doctrine of Discovery, and not the head of any other church. no other church has such a thing.
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@weekend_editor @tofugolem https://holocaustcenter.jfcs.org/education-resources/ordinary-men/ is one such book (I haven’t read it though)
And then a nice article: We are Not "Good Germans"
While echoes with the 1930s abound, a closer look at how Germans failed to stop Hitler suggests that America's antibodies are much stronger.
By Micah L. SifryThanks!
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@tofugolem Having followed news about the occupation of Minneapolis, I was shocked recently to read about Evangelical churches like Cities Church welcoming it, seeing ICE as righteous men fighting degeneracy.
https://baptistnews.com/article/lets-talk-about-how-cities-church-treats-women/
It's easy to reach for Nazis as comparison. But the US has such a long lineage of weaponizing a particular version of Christianity to create all manner of abuses. Slavery, Indigenous genocide, Iraq invasion as a crusade by "God's chosen nation", etc. Its hard to imagine that ever really being reckoned with.
@PapyrusBrigade @tofugolem It's often neglected that the Nazis were mostly Christians in good standing with the churches.
Modern Christianity has never had real strong opinions about evil done in their name.
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