People are cheapskates with poor people but spendthrift with billionaires.
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I'm struggling to even getting myself into the headspace where two people working a truck is upsetting to me.
Maybe this person works for UPS or some delivery company where drivers work alone and it is often *very dangerous*. (but just workable I guess? They still block traffic all the time) and they want everyone to suffer?
How do you look at a $7,000,000 patriot missile and get mad about more people being employed in the very honorable and *life-saving* work of collecting garbage?
@futurebird I assume it’s because it’s “dirty work” while a CEO looks nice and clean, wearing a suit, but probably has blood on their hands.
People look down on service industry workers, retail workers, and anyone they see as being “below” them.
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They make decent money. And that should be a model for how more jobs should be not a reason to try to ruin it.
It also really is a dangerous job and you can't do it forever. You need to switch to something less intense in your 40s or 50s because it's physically demanding.
@futurebird 100%. If I look back at the job I did in my mid-40s I know it would be quite a struggle with another dozen years added on as it is today, even ignoring my current health problems.
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@futurebird Reminds me of the joke about the guy who will do anything to protect his family but he just means killing someone. Not anything actually useful like making sure the kids are clean, well fed, getting with housework, etc.
@baishen @futurebird This is all very "Protestant work ethics", classism, and trying to find ways to be a dick to others on the basis of some bullshit reason to feel superior to them.
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@baishen @futurebird This is all very "Protestant work ethics", classism, and trying to find ways to be a dick to others on the basis of some bullshit reason to feel superior to them.
@baishen @futurebird I mean, did anybody pay attention to who were the critical workers six years ago? I believe that, contrary to what it may seem, yes, most people did, and that broke the brains of techbros and plutocrats, because their fucking charade about how they deserve to be overpaid fucks was there for everybody to see.
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Maybe it just because it's the kind of thing that seems "smart" that's how most media frame it.
If I had a dime for every guy who has said to me "the largest expense for a business is payroll" like it was some kind of revelation maybe I'd be rich enough that I'd understand how they think about jobs.
Of course the largest expense is payroll! If it isn't what is your company even doing? Probably not anything of value.
@futurebird @billiglarper top three business expenses:
* payroll (yours)
* payroll (your suppliers')
* payroll (your suppliers', amortised) -
@baishen @futurebird This is all very "Protestant work ethics", classism, and trying to find ways to be a dick to others on the basis of some bullshit reason to feel superior to them.
It's just I thought that part of "work ethic" was valuing work. Saying "thank you" when someone cooks and brings you a meal. Understanding that if someone cleans up after you? You should have deep respect and thankfulness for them helping you in that way.
Nothing feels more like "spoiled brat" to me than someone who doesn't respect this kind of work.
They could have just left you sitting in your own trash and you would deserve it. (The way I see it anyway.)
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How have so many people been trained to think like they are private equity managers who just want to cut every job, anything that makes middle class people exist?
And this comment had a bunch of likes ... none of the people getting mad about this really are private equity managers. They won't get rich. But the sight of people with "cushy" (livable, decent) jobs just makes them mad?
It's so depressing.
@futurebird
and at the same time, when it comes to taxing businesses or making them be responsible or have consequences or any of that and they don't like it, it's like "but they create JOBS! Can't ask anything else of them, they make JOBS happen!"It's like... THEORETICALY creating jobs is good, a goal, an excuse for everything else whenever it suits the CEOs I guess.
But when people are actually getting paid for jobs that's bad???
Maybe I just don't understand economics or how people talk about them ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
(Btw I moved to Finland recently where workers are pretty well protected and there are enough ppl employed to do each job and like... everything is so much better. Everyone is more chill and things tend to actually get done and get done properly and way fewer people are grumpy or miserable, plus public spaces are nice to be in.)
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@baishen @futurebird I mean, did anybody pay attention to who were the critical workers six years ago? I believe that, contrary to what it may seem, yes, most people did, and that broke the brains of techbros and plutocrats, because their fucking charade about how they deserve to be overpaid fucks was there for everybody to see.
"Essential workers" really showed everyone WHO makes everything possible day to day.
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Maybe it just because it's the kind of thing that seems "smart" that's how most media frame it.
If I had a dime for every guy who has said to me "the largest expense for a business is payroll" like it was some kind of revelation maybe I'd be rich enough that I'd understand how they think about jobs.
Of course the largest expense is payroll! If it isn't what is your company even doing? Probably not anything of value.
@futurebird @billiglarper That last paragraph goes perfectly with this. :-D
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It's just I thought that part of "work ethic" was valuing work. Saying "thank you" when someone cooks and brings you a meal. Understanding that if someone cleans up after you? You should have deep respect and thankfulness for them helping you in that way.
Nothing feels more like "spoiled brat" to me than someone who doesn't respect this kind of work.
They could have just left you sitting in your own trash and you would deserve it. (The way I see it anyway.)
@futurebird @Illuminatus @baishen
100 %
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@futurebird @billiglarper That last paragraph goes perfectly with this. :-D
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People are cheapskates with poor people but spendthrift with billionaires.
I just listened to someone complaining about how "the garbage union" has schemed so that there are always two people operating NYC garbage trucks to "waste my tax dollars" and I guess making too many wealthy sanitation workers... oh no the horror.
I like that there are two people on each truck. It's more efficient and safer. But, even if it was somehow a waste I promise you that's not who is wasting your money bud.
@futurebird That's so weird. In the UK I've never seen less than a small crew per truck and they get the job done fast. Why would anyone want that service but worse?
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People are cheapskates with poor people but spendthrift with billionaires.
I just listened to someone complaining about how "the garbage union" has schemed so that there are always two people operating NYC garbage trucks to "waste my tax dollars" and I guess making too many wealthy sanitation workers... oh no the horror.
I like that there are two people on each truck. It's more efficient and safer. But, even if it was somehow a waste I promise you that's not who is wasting your money bud.
@futurebird Guessing that the commenter's workplace is not unionized....
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"Essential workers" really showed everyone WHO makes everything possible day to day.
@futurebird @Illuminatus @baishen yup, if they are being paid a pittance, they are probably extremely important to keep everything running
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@futurebird @billiglarper That last paragraph goes perfectly with this. :-D
@baishen Perhaps I don’t understand how business works, but “my half-million dollar employee had better cost me three quarters of a million dollars or I’m gonna be pissed” is a hell of a take. @futurebird @billiglarper
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@futurebird @billiglarper That last paragraph goes perfectly with this. :-D
@baishen @futurebird @billiglarper Everything Huang said in this interview is a giant steaming pile of horseshit.
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@futurebird @ehproque
We have some trucks that have one guy driving with a robotic arm to pickup the trash. They're cool but not faster than the trucks with two guys on the back grabbing bins from both sides of the street at once. I expect their maintenance and down time is more, though. It's possible we have fewer people here interested in the work and more distance to cover so maybe it's worth it. And our streets are way less crowded so one truck looping around multiple times is less ...@futurebird @ehproque
...disruptive. But I like seeing all the guys on the trucks. I'd rather pay them than my health insurance CEO. -
This whole thing where they are so excited to eliminate real honorable work, like taking care of old people and taking away the garbage at ANY COST transmits a kind of deep disrespect for real work that I just can't abide. It is so deeply anti-social.
I love high tech solutions and robots. These things can make this work faster, and more effective. It can make the work safer. DSNY die in the line of duty all the time.
We should talk about that more.
@futurebird @ehproque
We have some trucks that have one guy driving with a robotic arm to pickup the trash. They're cool but not faster than the trucks with two guys on the back grabbing bins from both sides of the street at once. I expect their maintenance and down time is more, though. It's possible we have fewer people here interested in the work and more distance to cover so maybe it's worth it. And our streets are way less crowded so one truck looping around multiple times is less ... -
@futurebird That's so weird. In the UK I've never seen less than a small crew per truck and they get the job done fast. Why would anyone want that service but worse?
We love making things worse in America. Like having one person trying to run an entire pharmacy. (here our "chemists" don't just fill prescriptions but there is a whole connivence store too kind of like Boots in there too. They want to just have one person do this whole thing.)
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People are cheapskates with poor people but spendthrift with billionaires.
I just listened to someone complaining about how "the garbage union" has schemed so that there are always two people operating NYC garbage trucks to "waste my tax dollars" and I guess making too many wealthy sanitation workers... oh no the horror.
I like that there are two people on each truck. It's more efficient and safer. But, even if it was somehow a waste I promise you that's not who is wasting your money bud.
@futurebird of all the public services, bins and sewage workers are surely the most incredibly under-recognised
Overall they probably improve society even more than doctors
