#ClimateDiary We are in intense #Heatpump vs new boiler discussions in our household at the moment, and it is quite something how geopolitics and radiators (and other practicalities like: will the humming be loud?) all swirl through my head at once.
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@EarthOrgUK @sean thank you so much! Really helpful
@pvonhellermannn @sean Including bonus live updates towards the end of the page today while the system is getting #annual #maintenace...
Living on the edge!
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#ClimateDiary We are in intense #Heatpump vs new boiler discussions in our household at the moment, and it is quite something how geopolitics and radiators (and other practicalities like: will the humming be loud?) all swirl through my head at once.
(Our house is old, terraced and high ceilings - it looks like it’s not impossible but challenging. Costs come into it too, of course. Also worried on this front: might geopolitics mean i will not earn any money next few years?)
@pvonhellermannn
I got my heatpump because of the Ukraine war. Well, I was wanting one anyway but that made it a lot more obvious how bad oil was for everything and that made me finally do it. I'm in an old terrace too which leaks like crazy. So it isn't cheap to heat but the HP has no problem capacity wise. -
#ClimateDiary We are in intense #Heatpump vs new boiler discussions in our household at the moment, and it is quite something how geopolitics and radiators (and other practicalities like: will the humming be loud?) all swirl through my head at once.
(Our house is old, terraced and high ceilings - it looks like it’s not impossible but challenging. Costs come into it too, of course. Also worried on this front: might geopolitics mean i will not earn any money next few years?)
@pvonhellermannn Something people should know before installing an ASHP is that your shower/bath water just won’t be as piping hot anymore. First-world problem, maybe, but a dealbreaker for some.
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@pvonhellermannn Something people should know before installing an ASHP is that your shower/bath water just won’t be as piping hot anymore. First-world problem, maybe, but a dealbreaker for some.
Can you not also have a hot tank with an immersion heater for the last little bit of heat-boosting? Or does that kind of system intrinsically not have a tank?
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Can you not also have a hot tank with an immersion heater for the last little bit of heat-boosting? Or does that kind of system intrinsically not have a tank?
@unchartedworlds @pvonhellermannn I can’t see why you couldn’t *add* that, but it wasn’t in the specs we were presented. It might change the calculus for some.
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@pvonhellermannn Something people should know before installing an ASHP is that your shower/bath water just won’t be as piping hot anymore. First-world problem, maybe, but a dealbreaker for some.
@adamgreenfield @pvonhellermannn mine heats to 55C vs 60C for the gas boiler
60C is painfully hot and always gets mixed down - in fact if you have a mixer tap you wont notice.
So the only real impact is that you need a slightly bigger water tank to store the slightly diluted hot water (if you see what I mean)
We have a legacy solar diverter that sends "excess" solar to the immersion and that does go to 60C on sunny days - I only notice when I'm hand washing dishes and it gets too hot.
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@pvonhellermannn I got one last August. It works well and it's quiet. Needs more room than boiler, and because electricity cost is excessive (due to gas setting the price point) heating bills have stayed about the same.
If you already have solar panels this will help the economics of it substantially, even more so if you have solar + battery. I do not, that's next on my list
@http_error_418 @pvonhellermannn we're doing quite well on the Octopus Cosy Tariff
It's a bit hard to work out costs - I made a start on number crunching but so far I just have a bunch of daily figures based on how much power was used at what time of day and how efficient the heat pump was running.
Today I have had heat at 4.4p per Kwh
gas at 6p per kwH * 85% efficiency would be 7p
During colder times the heat pump has been less efficient but I think overall it's been cheaper.
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@pvonhellermannn
I got my heatpump because of the Ukraine war. Well, I was wanting one anyway but that made it a lot more obvious how bad oil was for everything and that made me finally do it. I'm in an old terrace too which leaks like crazy. So it isn't cheap to heat but the HP has no problem capacity wise.Ukraine, Putin, Iran, Trump...
I'm very happy to be on British renewables
Cheaper and less bloody
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@pvonhellermannn I think the anxiety about heat pump noise is very much driven by the fossil fuel lobby
Have you ever heard anyone complain about the noise of air conditioning ?
(air conditioners and heat pumps are the same thing just used in different ways)
This isn't to say I can promise nobody will ever complain about the noise - sounds can trigger very emotional reactions
But it isn't actually about them being loud.
@sean @pvonhellermannn Yes, that's my thought too. It does make some noise, but so did the air conditioner it replaced.
In my climate, the savings are substantial in the summer, and it's about equal to gas heat during the coldest months. This may change going forward!
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@sean @pvonhellermannn Yes, that's my thought too. It does make some noise, but so did the air conditioner it replaced.
In my climate, the savings are substantial in the summer, and it's about equal to gas heat during the coldest months. This may change going forward!
@ClimateJenny @sean thank you both - all really helpful, again. And yes, goong forward i am wondering too whether gas might become substantially more expensive, in which case heatpump definitely cheaper!
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@bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny in the UK domestic Aircon is very unusual
In order to encourage transition from gas boilers to heat pumps the government is offering a subsidy which only applies to heat pumps that heat via radiators
They don't offer cooling
You can get air to air systems here which offer both heating and cooling - you just can't get the subsidy for them
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@bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny in the UK domestic Aircon is very unusual
In order to encourage transition from gas boilers to heat pumps the government is offering a subsidy which only applies to heat pumps that heat via radiators
They don't offer cooling
You can get air to air systems here which offer both heating and cooling - you just can't get the subsidy for them
@pvonhellermannn from the Politico heat-pump article I posted earlier
"I later discovered the company Warmur*, who provide a survey service that charges one upfront fee, but allow multiple installers to provide quotes based on the same report. It's the first of many things I wish I’d known earlier."
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@bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny in the UK domestic Aircon is very unusual
In order to encourage transition from gas boilers to heat pumps the government is offering a subsidy which only applies to heat pumps that heat via radiators
They don't offer cooling
You can get air to air systems here which offer both heating and cooling - you just can't get the subsidy for them
@sean @bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny
As of November 2025 the UK government offers £2,500 grant for Air to Air Source Heat Pumps (which can do cooling). Also Heat batteries come under the same scheme
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/discounts-for-families-to-keep-warm-in-winter-and-cool-in-summer
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@sean @bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny
As of November 2025 the UK government offers £2,500 grant for Air to Air Source Heat Pumps (which can do cooling). Also Heat batteries come under the same scheme
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/discounts-for-families-to-keep-warm-in-winter-and-cool-in-summer
@michaelokarimia @bencourtice @pvonhellermannn @ClimateJenny
Interesting - sounds like it isn't available just yet though
https://renewableheatinghub.co.uk/air-to-air-heat-pump-bus-grant-explained/
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#ClimateDiary We are in intense #Heatpump vs new boiler discussions in our household at the moment, and it is quite something how geopolitics and radiators (and other practicalities like: will the humming be loud?) all swirl through my head at once.
(Our house is old, terraced and high ceilings - it looks like it’s not impossible but challenging. Costs come into it too, of course. Also worried on this front: might geopolitics mean i will not earn any money next few years?)
@pvonhellermannn My only argument here is this: the same people who are against this have the same (or louder) equipments in their second residences in Spain. Either they enjoy bothering their Spaniard neighbours or the technology isn’t that loud or inefficient (spoiler: it isn’t, we have those everywhere).
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#ClimateDiary We are in intense #Heatpump vs new boiler discussions in our household at the moment, and it is quite something how geopolitics and radiators (and other practicalities like: will the humming be loud?) all swirl through my head at once.
(Our house is old, terraced and high ceilings - it looks like it’s not impossible but challenging. Costs come into it too, of course. Also worried on this front: might geopolitics mean i will not earn any money next few years?)
@pvonhellermannn
We have a larger, older house and have had heat pump for some 18 months (2 winters).
It's quiet and costs are about the same / less than gas (difficult to be precise given changing tariffs, warmer house and change from gas cooker).
Top tip, check the installer's heat loss calculations, e.g. room size measurements. Ours made an error (identified before installation) and so gave us radiator labour free.
You don't want to oversize or undersize. Consider hot water panels (greener) -
@pvonhellermannn
We have a larger, older house and have had heat pump for some 18 months (2 winters).
It's quiet and costs are about the same / less than gas (difficult to be precise given changing tariffs, warmer house and change from gas cooker).
Top tip, check the installer's heat loss calculations, e.g. room size measurements. Ours made an error (identified before installation) and so gave us radiator labour free.
You don't want to oversize or undersize. Consider hot water panels (greener)@pvonhellermannn
On heat loss calcs, they are critical to comfort and efficiency. You don't want too big or too small. Our neighbours were offered too big a pump because installer hadn't correct size in stock.Older terrace, you might need better insulation - it will work OK without but would use less energy and reduce running costs (but up front will cost - go for 'low hanging, cheap fruit' first).
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@pvonhellermannn
On heat loss calcs, they are critical to comfort and efficiency. You don't want too big or too small. Our neighbours were offered too big a pump because installer hadn't correct size in stock.Older terrace, you might need better insulation - it will work OK without but would use less energy and reduce running costs (but up front will cost - go for 'low hanging, cheap fruit' first).
@markhburton thank you Mark, this is all incredibly helpful. The boiler/heat pump installer/plumber who is talking us through all this, mentioned this too - that it’s really key to get all the calculations right. We are a little bit wary of having to install a lot of additional radiators - we may get a detailed calculation/survey done before committing fully!
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@markhburton thank you Mark, this is all incredibly helpful. The boiler/heat pump installer/plumber who is talking us through all this, mentioned this too - that it’s really key to get all the calculations right. We are a little bit wary of having to install a lot of additional radiators - we may get a detailed calculation/survey done before committing fully!
@pvonhellermannn
We had to change 5/13 rads. -
@markhburton thank you Mark, this is all incredibly helpful. The boiler/heat pump installer/plumber who is talking us through all this, mentioned this too - that it’s really key to get all the calculations right. We are a little bit wary of having to install a lot of additional radiators - we may get a detailed calculation/survey done before committing fully!
I don't have Mark's practical experience, but liked watching 'Heat Geek' explainers on YouTube.
Also, someone was telling me underspecification or bad installation by contractors is a big problem in social housing and a reason why some people are heat-pump-sceptical.
