I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
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@tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat This probably won't translate well, but in Geometry we had a teacher from Frankonia who would say "the boint B" (der Bunkt B) und write a "P" on the board, and then "the line from A to B" and write A and B on the board and drew a line between them.
So if you just listened you had two points in mind, when there were in fact three.@thechris @tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat My algorithms and data structures professor in Norway was not a native speaker and pronounced "én" (one, stress on the e) and "enn" (the letter N, stress on the n) the same, so you really had to pay attention to the slides when she was teaching big O notation so you didn't get O(1) and O(n) mixed up.
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T tokeriis@helvede.net shared this topic
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat Fascinating! In my UK primary school, ~1980, we sang/chanted the same but swapping the multiplier and multiplicand:
one two is two
two twos are four
three twos are six
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@svat I'm not at all an expert in this, but I can see how fitting the tables into 'four syllables each' and reducing the numbers to not include plurals would sort of do something like 'byte-alignment in our brains that are used to music'.
@DarcMoughty @svat this is the way it's done in chinese
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The times table, or rote learning, is a good way of learning certain basic, fixed relationships. The whole class in my primary school would recite them at once. I'm wondering if schools do things differently now? I imagine so, but I can't think of another equally effective way of doing it.
@riggbeck @svat my children are made to play https://www.topmarks.co.uk/maths-games/hit-the-button - quickfire times tables questions - and compete on speed. Less dull than chanting but they still hate it
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The times table, or rote learning, is a good way of learning certain basic, fixed relationships. The whole class in my primary school would recite them at once. I'm wondering if schools do things differently now? I imagine so, but I can't think of another equally effective way of doing it.
@riggbeck @svat I am not particularly mathematical, but when I learned the “times table” in the 1960s, I recall finding simple patterns that helped me to both recite the table in class and to do arithmetic in my head.
I am not an educator either, but it feels to me like a wasted opportunity if the only thing we use tables for is rote memorization.
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat I worked in IT with an Indian guy for years who always pronounced the "@" in email ids as "at-a-rate-of" (spoken quickly, jammed together) instead of simply "at". I never mentioned it to him but I assumed it originated from a similar school-days training experience.
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@iris @thechris @tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat
Clue given by the fact the German word for "point" should be "Punkt", not "Bunkt".@timjan @thechris @tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat caught the hint, still didn't catch the meaning.
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The times table, or rote learning, is a good way of learning certain basic, fixed relationships. The whole class in my primary school would recite them at once. I'm wondering if schools do things differently now? I imagine so, but I can't think of another equally effective way of doing it.
@riggbeck I had one teacher who made us race to fill out a grid which had the numbers 1-10 down the side and along the top, and in each cell you had to write what the corresponding pair multiplied to. I think at the start of the year the numbers were all in order, and as we got better at it she jumbled up the numbers.
I was probably the only person in the class who actually really enjoyed it.
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat come to think of it the 'be' verb is really a postfix 'eval'
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat fantastic thread. Did not know about egg corns. I worked with 2 non-native English speakers from different countries (Germany, Finland) that both thought that the slightly crude and dismissive ‘I can’t be arsed’ was in fact, ‘I can’t be asked’, making it politer, and still functionally equivalent.
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@riggbeck @svat I am not particularly mathematical, but when I learned the “times table” in the 1960s, I recall finding simple patterns that helped me to both recite the table in class and to do arithmetic in my head.
I am not an educator either, but it feels to me like a wasted opportunity if the only thing we use tables for is rote memorization.
Me too. I saw the pattern, used it and enjoyed it. But a lot of my classmates hated the whole thing and no doubt it turned them off maths for life.
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@riggbeck I had one teacher who made us race to fill out a grid which had the numbers 1-10 down the side and along the top, and in each cell you had to write what the corresponding pair multiplied to. I think at the start of the year the numbers were all in order, and as we got better at it she jumbled up the numbers.
I was probably the only person in the class who actually really enjoyed it.
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat It's almost Reverse Polish Notation, such as older HP calculators used. For example, 2x6 is keyed as 2 ^enter^ 6 ^enter^ x which gives 12.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_Polish_notation -
@riggbeck @svat my children are made to play https://www.topmarks.co.uk/maths-games/hit-the-button - quickfire times tables questions - and compete on speed. Less dull than chanting but they still hate it
The problem may be with 'made to play'.
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@timjan @thechris @tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat caught the hint, still didn't catch the meaning.
@iris @timjan @thechris @tessarakt @weekend_editor @svat If I understood the story, then in other words:
The points mentioned would be P, A and B, but due to dialect and the structure of the language someone just listening misses the P, because of the phonetical similarity or homophone nature of how P and B are spoken in that dialect. Does it make sense?
I happen to speak a language that doesn't have native words with "b" and when I say my name, starting with "p", German speaker hear "b". -
The problem may be with 'made to play'.
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I went to school in India, and we learned the multiplication tables with a chant that involved a postfix operator called "zaar":
two one zaar two
two two zaar four
two three zaar six
two four zaar eight
two five zaar ten
two six zaar twelve
…We just accepted such a postfix operator as the most natural thing, and freely used it when talking to each other: “what is seven six zaar?” (42)
Some of us were adults before realizing (and some probably never realizing) that these “tables” we all sang as children had probably started as:
two ones are two
two twos are four
…@svat
Calling @gretchenmcc this would make an amazing @lingthusiasm anecdote / bonus ep? -
J jwcph@helvede.net shared this topic
