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  3. I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

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  • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

    I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

    I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

    In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

    1/2

    vatvslpr@c.imV This user is from outside of this forum
    vatvslpr@c.imV This user is from outside of this forum
    vatvslpr@c.im
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #9

    @grammargirl
    I prefer "bullshit" to "hallucination". It gets much closer to what's really happening, and it gives users a much better idea of how to deal with it.

    finitebaffle@mas.toF 1 Reply Last reply
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    • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

      I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

      I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

      In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

      1/2

      jawnsy@mastodon.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
      jawnsy@mastodon.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
      jawnsy@mastodon.social
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #10

      @grammargirl Tools are useful, but they are never a substitute for human judgement. It's like people who write something and accept corrections from spell check without thinking about what the words mean.

      The most powerful tools are most powerful in the hands of those who can validate correctness quickly. We're still responsible for validating all facts, regardless of source. We can't outsource critical thinking to machines, which do not think at all.

      1 Reply Last reply
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      • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

        The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

        "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

        "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

        hopeward@sunny.gardenH This user is from outside of this forum
        hopeward@sunny.gardenH This user is from outside of this forum
        hopeward@sunny.garden
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #11

        @grammargirl
        Hallucinations can only happen to a mind. An LLM has no more mind than a slot machine.

        The people making this stuff fell in love with their own convincing automatons, so attributed ‘hallucination’ as happening to their little babies.

        It’s a much different thing if you say ‘this brainless machine is constantly making errors and spitting incorrect data’.

        If you say that, it means back to the drawing board: this demo tech has failed.

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

          I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

          I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

          In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

          1/2

          sambowne@infosec.exchangeS This user is from outside of this forum
          sambowne@infosec.exchangeS This user is from outside of this forum
          sambowne@infosec.exchange
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #12

          @grammargirl "Delusion" would have been better, but the ship has sailed.

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • queenofnewyork@newsie.socialQ queenofnewyork@newsie.social

            @grammargirl Hm. It’s not always obvious if a person you are talking to is hallucinating, depending on what their hallucinations are and what they say.

            I get their point, just am sad on the mental illness rep side.

            fragarach@social.vivaldi.netF This user is from outside of this forum
            fragarach@social.vivaldi.netF This user is from outside of this forum
            fragarach@social.vivaldi.net
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #13

            @queenofnewyork @grammargirl
            I think the film "A Beautiful Mind" brought home to me just how real hallucinations are to those who are experience them.
            Which I hadn't previously appreciated.

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

              The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

              "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

              "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

              merileedkarr@federated.pressM This user is from outside of this forum
              merileedkarr@federated.pressM This user is from outside of this forum
              merileedkarr@federated.press
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #14

              @grammargirl
              The industry named its own mistakes ‘hallucinations.’
              Hallucinations is a forgiving term.
              ‘Delusions’ would be more accurate.

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • vatvslpr@c.imV vatvslpr@c.im

                @grammargirl
                I prefer "bullshit" to "hallucination". It gets much closer to what's really happening, and it gives users a much better idea of how to deal with it.

                finitebaffle@mas.toF This user is from outside of this forum
                finitebaffle@mas.toF This user is from outside of this forum
                finitebaffle@mas.to
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #15

                @VATVSLPR @grammargirl you’re backed up by academia https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10676-024-09775-5

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                  I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                  I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                  In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                  1/2

                  burnt_veggies@mstdn.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  burnt_veggies@mstdn.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  burnt_veggies@mstdn.social
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #16

                  @grammargirl As a mental health nurse, I would say delusions would be a more accurate term than hallucinations. I would also point out as someone else said that unless you are trained to do so, you may not know someone is experiencing hallucinations. Many who experience them chronically are quite good at presenting as if they aren't.

                  grammargirl@zirk.usG 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                    I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                    I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                    In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                    1/2

                    mattdm@hachyderm.ioM This user is from outside of this forum
                    mattdm@hachyderm.ioM This user is from outside of this forum
                    mattdm@hachyderm.io
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #17

                    @grammargirl

                    "Confabulation", although that is still anthropomorphism and implies agency which doesn't exist.

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                      I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                      I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                      In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                      1/2

                      glc@mastodon.onlineG This user is from outside of this forum
                      glc@mastodon.onlineG This user is from outside of this forum
                      glc@mastodon.online
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #18

                      @grammargirl

                      I've been "opposed" to that (to the extent that it ever makes sense to oppose established language usage) from the start, favoring "fabrication".

                      All LLMs fabricate sentence-like objects which invite the user to hallucinate some meaning into them. Users then react to how they feel about the meaning that they themselves have imposed.

                      If one recognizes that all of the outputs are fabrications and that some fraction of them may be useful, one can go sanely about one's business.

                      1 Reply Last reply
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                      • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                        I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                        I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                        In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                        1/2

                        bwebster@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                        bwebster@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                        bwebster@mastodon.social
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #19

                        @grammargirl @Cdespinosa I propose the term “botsplaining”

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • gleick@mas.toG gleick@mas.to

                          @grammargirl I don’t think we need to accept it just yet. The word is deceptive—intentionally so. What needs to be explained is this: chatbots and LLMs can't "hallucinate” because they have no minds or senses. They routinely depart from factuality because that's how they’re programmed: to generate plausible streams of text without regard to reality. (https://around.com/dont-trust-them/)

                          coolcalmcollected@mastodon.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                          coolcalmcollected@mastodon.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                          coolcalmcollected@mastodon.social
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #20

                          @gleick @grammargirl

                          the consistent trend of anthropomorphizing badly written programs, and the machines the programs run on, is used to make tech CEO's as a religious ruling class.

                          they create these facsimiles of truth and reality then prop themselves up as the sole interpreters and arbiters. like any religious hierarchy.

                          they're relying on humans ingrained need to assign importance to random objects and events and an interpreter to hand out judgement in return for taking all their money.

                          1 Reply Last reply
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                          • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                            The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

                            "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

                            "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

                            mikestok@mstdn.caM This user is from outside of this forum
                            mikestok@mstdn.caM This user is from outside of this forum
                            mikestok@mstdn.ca
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #21

                            @grammargirl these folks are stealing language to whitewash a con. In my opinion.

                            Hallucination is a deviation from the normal way healthy human minds work. The confident incorrectness presented by the companies shilling AI is working as designed.

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                              The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

                              "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

                              "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

                              feisty_lemming@zeroes.caF This user is from outside of this forum
                              feisty_lemming@zeroes.caF This user is from outside of this forum
                              feisty_lemming@zeroes.ca
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #22

                              @grammargirl But what actually is the point of using it if I have to confirm all facts? Can’t I just skip the middleman?

                              grammargirl@zirk.usG 1 Reply Last reply
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                              • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                                The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

                                "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

                                "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

                                drangnon@hachyderm.ioD This user is from outside of this forum
                                drangnon@hachyderm.ioD This user is from outside of this forum
                                drangnon@hachyderm.io
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #23

                                @grammargirl like when medical people call someone "confused", AI "hallucination" is a more precise term than common parlance. it basically means the bot couldn't find a plausible answer and is for some reason blocked from saying "I don't know", so it makes stuff up.

                                that's a bit different from "confidently makes mistakes" becuase it's "confidently making stuff up entirely".

                                I have no idea what would be a good replacement for "hallucinate" in this context, I agree that it feels deceptive as is though.

                                benaveling@infosec.exchangeB 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • gleick@mas.toG gleick@mas.to

                                  @grammargirl I don’t think we need to accept it just yet. The word is deceptive—intentionally so. What needs to be explained is this: chatbots and LLMs can't "hallucinate” because they have no minds or senses. They routinely depart from factuality because that's how they’re programmed: to generate plausible streams of text without regard to reality. (https://around.com/dont-trust-them/)

                                  davemwilburn@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
                                  davemwilburn@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
                                  davemwilburn@infosec.exchange
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #24

                                  @gleick @grammargirl

                                  IMO "confabulation" is more accurate than "hallucination" because the former indicates a lack of intent. Given that LLMs are not sentient, they lack intention. At most, they are reflexively responding to a reward function that optimizes towards producing text roughly resembling the pattern of their training data, but that's different from intent.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                                    I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                                    I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                                    In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                                    1/2

                                    codepitbull@chaos.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                    codepitbull@chaos.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                    codepitbull@chaos.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #25

                                    @grammargirl I have a general dislike to use terms related to human cognition for anything AI does. There are already enough loonies out there who think a system throwing way too many dice could be their friend or is anything more than the dice. We need other/better terms for that.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                                      I've never been opposed to the word "hallucinating" for describing how AI makes mistakes ... until now.

                                      I just talked to someone who thought AI hallucinations would be obvious because it would be obvious if you talked to a *person* who was hallucinating.

                                      In other words, they equated "hallucination" with "sounds wacko" and accepted AI output as true because it sounded level headed.

                                      1/2

                                      michaelgemar@cosocial.caM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      michaelgemar@cosocial.caM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      michaelgemar@cosocial.ca
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #26

                                      @grammargirl I oppose the term because it implies that LLMs are conscious, and occasionally have “experiences” that aren’t true, instead of being just text-generating software that outputs incorrect information.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • grammargirl@zirk.usG grammargirl@zirk.us

                                        The word "hallucination" isn't going away — it's a widely used industry term — but we need to explain it better for beginners:

                                        "Hallucination" is just a fancy word for "confidently makes mistakes":

                                        "Remember: AI hallucinates, and you need to confirm all facts" should be something like "Remember: AI confidently makes mistakes, and you need to confirm all facts" or "AI tells you things that are wrong in a way that sounds completely believable. Confirm all facts!"

                                        maxleibman@beige.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        maxleibman@beige.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        maxleibman@beige.party
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #27

                                        @grammargirl I agree it’s not going away. I still find it constructive to point out it’s misleading, though, because it’s a good framing device for talking about what these technologies are and are not actually doing.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • feisty_lemming@zeroes.caF feisty_lemming@zeroes.ca

                                          @grammargirl But what actually is the point of using it if I have to confirm all facts? Can’t I just skip the middleman?

                                          grammargirl@zirk.usG This user is from outside of this forum
                                          grammargirl@zirk.usG This user is from outside of this forum
                                          grammargirl@zirk.us
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #28

                                          @feisty_lemming It depends on what you're using it for. If you're fact checking, it can be faster to put in a document and say something like "Fact check this piece. Show your sources," which gives you a list of links to click and check. It's faster than putting each thing you want to check into Google and then sorting through the links (and now the AI slop too). It will also surface relevant links you may have missed that don't show up in the first 10 or 20 on Google.

                                          grammargirl@zirk.usG feisty_lemming@zeroes.caF 2 Replies Last reply
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