Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
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@paulywill they can.. of course. But you need to unlock the bootloader to do that.. and you can't do that while its locked
That's the entire issue..
@codemonkeymike @paulywill What exactly keeps the bootloader locked ?
If its a password or a config, or anything that is runtime change-able, it is then kept alive by the onboard battery.
So cutting off ALL available power should hard reset the thing.The only way around this is if Apple hard coded the lock/password/whatever on a silicon level.
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike Proprietary hardware proprietary results. -
Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike counterpoint is that it's preventing theft so...
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike @xeno oh dear, that's quite the fancy stack of paperweights
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike what the fuck
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike The sad part of this too is most #Apple Macs post T2 might not be suitable collectors items because of this. I own a lot vintage era #PowerBook G4's and G3's and there were times where I might want to reinstall OS X. Doing that is next to impossible on devices like this. Not to mention, even pre-T2 machines, if you don't use them for a while they lock you out requiring resetting the password through recovery.
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike Android tablets are exactly the same, by the way.
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@Victorsigmoid have you seen the video of that? I just watched it and holy shit its intense haha.
I mean I AM considering it.. but what a nightmare.. its' super time consuming.. and you still need another up to date mac to hook it up to in DFW mode..
So even after ALL that.. you still end up needing a current Mac.. god i hate them
@codemonkeymike Yes it looked like something to undertake if and only if the plan is to learn it as a skill then use it for a while. If I had a few months' worth of laptops to liberate, though, it would be a fun challenge. Plus the desoldering and resoldering is a skill applicable to other repair and analysis. I think Matt Brown's hardware pen testing videos have gotten to me!
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@codemonkeymike
I'll be curious to see that, do you have a link to it?
@Victorsigmoid@magnetic_tape @codemonkeymike I watched the ifixit video, https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/How+to+Remove+MacBook+ID+Activation+Lock+by+T203/143072
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@codemonkeymike @paulywill What exactly keeps the bootloader locked ?
If its a password or a config, or anything that is runtime change-able, it is then kept alive by the onboard battery.
So cutting off ALL available power should hard reset the thing.The only way around this is if Apple hard coded the lock/password/whatever on a silicon level.
@yama @codemonkeymike @paulywill
It's in non-volatile memory (EEPROM) embedded in the chipset. It won't forget for 100 years. -
Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike I've had go stop taking most idevices because even after resetting them they end up being locked to a schools activation server which makes them unusable
So they all end up going to recycle -
Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike i've been asked about this for android because someone was given an old tablet and FRP won't let them reinstall the device. -
@codemonkeymike @paulywill What exactly keeps the bootloader locked ?
If its a password or a config, or anything that is runtime change-able, it is then kept alive by the onboard battery.
So cutting off ALL available power should hard reset the thing.The only way around this is if Apple hard coded the lock/password/whatever on a silicon level.
@yama @codemonkeymike @paulywill Why would they put it in volatile storage kept alive with a battery, if they have flash memory?
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@codemonkeymike but if Apple can remove the lock then surely it’s equally possible that someone else could too which would sort of defeat the purpose, wouldn’t it?
Certainly, I would agree that if a person goes through the steps to wipe the machine to give it away or sell then that process should absolutely remove all of the security locks from the machine.
@LoneLocust @codemonkeymike no, only Apple can clear it from their server database.
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@LoneLocust @codemonkeymike no, only Apple can clear it from their server database.
@nicolas17 @codemonkeymike I’m genuinely not understanding what you mean. Is the problem the T2 chip that can’t be circumvented, or something on Apple’s server?
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike Suspect you are talking about two different things. For a machine owned by an end user, removing the iCloud account and performing a factory reset absolutely makes that Mac available for activation and use by a new user, T2 or no. However, if the device is owned by the end user’s school or employer and enrolled by that organization to their device management, they would have to unenroll it.
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@codemonkeymike Suspect you are talking about two different things. For a machine owned by an end user, removing the iCloud account and performing a factory reset absolutely makes that Mac available for activation and use by a new user, T2 or no. However, if the device is owned by the end user’s school or employer and enrolled by that organization to their device management, they would have to unenroll it.
@codemonkeymike The organization can do that from their Device Enrollment Portal, if they are willing to do so. The organization’s device management may also have to be removed. Agree that that sucks for someone in your position but if an individual is giving you a device that’s enrolled in that way usually it’s not theirs to give away.
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike yikes. I was just reading about imjtool and fighting edl qualcomm and some of the tools might help with T2?? I hate this shit
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Another reason to hate #Apple We're seeing more 2018+ MacBook Pro/Air donations — but Apple's T2 chip means even after iCloud sign-out and reset, the firmware stays locked to the original account.
Without donor contact, these machines are useless.
I've upcycled ~1,000 older Macs, but T2 era machines will end that. It's controlling, creates e-waste, and will only get worse. #righttorepair matters — Apple couldn't care less.
@codemonkeymike
If you recycle them through apple you should get gift cards? -
@yama @codemonkeymike @paulywill Why would they put it in volatile storage kept alive with a battery, if they have flash memory?
@nicolas17 @yama @codemonkeymike @paulywill this, most modern machines use NVRAM for variable store. You can't reset it by just yoinking the power.
Not sure how it's done on T2-based x86 (assuming T2 acts as ROT), x86 itself isn't fused so firmware isn't tamper-protected but it could be done by T2 (from what I remember, T2 emulates SPI to the x86 host and actual x86 UEFI lives in dedicated portion of an "SSD".
T2 should be vulnerable to checkra1n though, so it should be possible to fool the ROT and at least modify NVRAM variables to change security policy but it would require some research.
