To eveyone on Mastodon:
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@LukefromDC I would love to understand where the fediverse is actually vulnerable.
I am nowhere near an expert on this but part of the fediverse is European and I guess it depends where the actual infrastructure is located and/or which company may host it.
The other part of course may be whether or not European politicians decide to go along and do whatever the US tells them to do - which, sadly not that unlikely. Especially Germany presents a risk here.
DNS is a big one. The .im TLD is owned by the Isle of Man so if the US sets sanctions on your instance and they decide to cooperate, they can seize the domain.
A lot of TLDs though are owned by US based entities and would have to go along with it.
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DNS is a big one. The .im TLD is owned by the Isle of Man so if the US sets sanctions on your instance and they decide to cooperate, they can seize the domain.
A lot of TLDs though are owned by US based entities and would have to go along with it.
Thanks, that gives some clarity.
With my instance is actually interesting. Team is in Estonia, data hosted in the Netherlands, TLD from Isle of Man so I am not sure what gets precedence here. Isle of Man is not EU, Estonia and the Netherlands are - that also matters.
Maybe it's not the worst idea for US-based instances to at least explore what it would mean to move everything. And all others to at least have a plan in place as well.
A voluntary user database that lives independently might also be an idea? Just in case everything gets down at once people can be reached and the community won't fall apart at once.
This should be a bigger fediverse-wide conversation.
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@LukefromDC I would love to understand where the fediverse is actually vulnerable.
I am nowhere near an expert on this but part of the fediverse is European and I guess it depends where the actual infrastructure is located and/or which company may host it.
The other part of course may be whether or not European politicians decide to go along and do whatever the US tells them to do - which, sadly not that unlikely. Especially Germany presents a risk here.
@thisislieven @LukefromDC most if not all Fediverse servers use the standard WebPKI trust root and do not support DANE as an alternative. this alone is enough to attract crawlers to new instances. with DANE, DNSSEC signs the TLSA records used to deliver the X.509 certs used, which may be self-signed or use an alternate PKI.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNS-based_Authentication_of_Named_Entities
for an experiment late last month I ran gotosocial on a Nuremberg VPS with a self-signed certificate, IPv6 only. there was no bot activity, but it would not federate.
PKI choices are a tradeoff. Some cybersecurity people criticize DANE on the basis that it puts DNSSEC trust into the hands of state actors. This is only true for the root TLD trust anchor, which can be used to deny trust for the DNS resource records YOU published, and if DANE TLSA is used as a Trust On First Use (TOFU) hand-off, the X.509 cert you served up in the past with DNSSEC signing of its TLSA record can then be trusted by the client from that point on by way of being cached already.
Because effectively, right now, using ACME with Let's Encrypt or Clownflare is like inviting ants to a picnic, in a cynical inversion of RFC 7258, "Pervasive Monitoring Is an Attack", which the authors even hinted at in that RFC.
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@thisislieven @LukefromDC most if not all Fediverse servers use the standard WebPKI trust root and do not support DANE as an alternative. this alone is enough to attract crawlers to new instances. with DANE, DNSSEC signs the TLSA records used to deliver the X.509 certs used, which may be self-signed or use an alternate PKI.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNS-based_Authentication_of_Named_Entities
for an experiment late last month I ran gotosocial on a Nuremberg VPS with a self-signed certificate, IPv6 only. there was no bot activity, but it would not federate.
PKI choices are a tradeoff. Some cybersecurity people criticize DANE on the basis that it puts DNSSEC trust into the hands of state actors. This is only true for the root TLD trust anchor, which can be used to deny trust for the DNS resource records YOU published, and if DANE TLSA is used as a Trust On First Use (TOFU) hand-off, the X.509 cert you served up in the past with DNSSEC signing of its TLSA record can then be trusted by the client from that point on by way of being cached already.
Because effectively, right now, using ACME with Let's Encrypt or Clownflare is like inviting ants to a picnic, in a cynical inversion of RFC 7258, "Pervasive Monitoring Is an Attack", which the authors even hinted at in that RFC.
Ok, so I am not a tech expert and my best understanding of your reply is that somehow the Danish people are involved and I think we don't like them but I am not quite sure (I know a fair few - lovely people as far as I can tell).
I appreciate your reply but do you have a non-jargon translation?
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC
What's next 4 me!
Fair Phone, pager, or off digi grid.
Off grid would be best. My fam blerts sensitive info wholly nilly & shame me for listening.
Bill -
@regendans @baedling @LukefromDC I don’t really see any specific actions to take unless we see “overcompliance”..?
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
The flood of cash from fossil fuel funded fascists to make this happen is getting truly astronomical.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/10/study-fossil-fuel-industry-lobbying-anti-protest-bills/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/sep/26/anti-protest-laws-fossil-fuel-lobby
https://ips-dc.org/inside-the-world-of-fossil-fuel-philanthropy/
https://www.commondreams.org/news/trump-counterterrorism-strategy-antifa
https://znetwork.org/znetarticle/the-myth-of-a-global-antifa/
https://dissentmagazine.org/article/fighting-fire-and-fascism-in-the-american-west/
https://www.bbc.com/news/live/cvgje507pn2t
The most corrupt industry on the planet is willing to do anything, literally anything, to keep its fossil fuel subsidies
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.aej2018 -
Thanks, that gives some clarity.
With my instance is actually interesting. Team is in Estonia, data hosted in the Netherlands, TLD from Isle of Man so I am not sure what gets precedence here. Isle of Man is not EU, Estonia and the Netherlands are - that also matters.
Maybe it's not the worst idea for US-based instances to at least explore what it would mean to move everything. And all others to at least have a plan in place as well.
A voluntary user database that lives independently might also be an idea? Just in case everything gets down at once people can be reached and the community won't fall apart at once.
This should be a bigger fediverse-wide conversation.
@thisislieven @gbargoud I think we can expect that in the future, servers hosting content attacking any one government will have to be either total darknet/torified or hosted in nations that regard the target nation as an enemy.
Thus, US left servers might be hosted in Cuba while far-right Cuban exiles would use US hosting.
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC Honestly wild. Never thought I'd see the day, but here we are.
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
What’s the back ground story?
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC not just ww2, the things considered normal now were absurd months ago, and the things normal then were absurd months before that.
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC
We need our govts to retaliate and block X and warn trump Meta and Tic Toc are next if he doesn't retreat. Tell him on a Tuesday morning. -
To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC And here I was worried about my Protonmail account. Wasn't even considering fedi.
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What’s the back ground story?
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@LukefromDC any tangible ideas on how to fight for A/I? i've been wanting to fight this but idk what can be done.
@baedling @LukefromDC I think that if you are American and you are a customer of these guys you might have basis to sue.
It's going to be what my sign is about tomorrow...
"What they're doing to Autistici/Invitati should scare the shit out of you," is what I was thinking of going with unless something better comes to mind or is suggested.
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Ty
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@baedling @LukefromDC Came here to ask basically this.
I'm not a technical (or in any way computery) person, so is there anything us normies can do?
@clickhere @baedling @LukefromDC One of the easiest and best first step is probably to sign up for Tuta or Proton or something and start using it.
Start taking your privacy very seriously. Learn as much as you can about how much you are sharing and how to stop.
And I think they suggested trying to make as many people as aware of this as you can. If not, that should help also.
Insist on the type of communication systems they provided and don't settle.
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To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
@LukefromDC So what do we do? I figured this already, but I'm not very activist. -
To eveyone on Mastodon:
The real lesson of the US attack on autistici/inventi is that WE ARE NEXT. Mastodon servers mostly do not run things like PRISM, are often based outside the US, and compete directly with the Tech Bros and their ad and tracker supported shit for an audience.
Also lots of anti-Trump activism here.
If we don't fight for autistici/inventi today, we will have to fight for Mastodon tomorrow. Domino effects are real with Fascists as we saw at the start of WWII.
-
@clickhere @baedling @LukefromDC One of the easiest and best first step is probably to sign up for Tuta or Proton or something and start using it.
Start taking your privacy very seriously. Learn as much as you can about how much you are sharing and how to stop.
And I think they suggested trying to make as many people as aware of this as you can. If not, that should help also.
Insist on the type of communication systems they provided and don't settle.
@crazyeddie @clickhere @baedling @LukefromDC I haven't heard anything about this. Is there a link to what's going on?
