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  3. Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

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  • gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green

    Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

    Half of Japan’s samurai were women, groundbreaking new exhibition at British Museum says
    https://www.independent.co.uk/asia/japan/british-museum-samurai-women-warrior-myth-b2913476.html

    The Viking Woman Warrior of Birka, Sweden
    https://www.history-channel.org/a-viking-mystery-the-woman-warrior-of-birka/

    Early Women Were Hunters, Not Just Gatherers
    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/

    ‘Woman the hunter’: Studies aim to correct history
    https://news.nd.edu/news/woman-the-hunter-studies-aim-to-correct-history/

    The sports where women outperform men
    https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240731-the-sports-where-women-outperform-men

    gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
    gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
    gimulnautti@mastodon.green
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #5

    @gerrymcgovern And MAGA is the force trying to rewrite history again.

    I’m quite sure this happens again and again and again. Because that’s the nature of dominance hierarchy behaviour.

    Co-operative people, egalitarian people, build. Then the dominators show up and pretend like they built it.

    gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG clfh@mastodon.greenC 2 Replies Last reply
    0
    • gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG gimulnautti@mastodon.green

      @gerrymcgovern And MAGA is the force trying to rewrite history again.

      I’m quite sure this happens again and again and again. Because that’s the nature of dominance hierarchy behaviour.

      Co-operative people, egalitarian people, build. Then the dominators show up and pretend like they built it.

      gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
      gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
      gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #6

      @gimulnautti That's it. Nothing but the same old story, but some manage to resist, and now that is what we must do.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • dirtwizard666@cyberpunk.lolD dirtwizard666@cyberpunk.lol

        @gerrymcgovern "In peacetime, particularly during the early 20th century that was a politically charged period for Japan as it engaged in colonial expansion, Dr Buckland says the samurai image was manipulated for the purposes of galvanising a national identity. " The word this writer is failing to use is "fascism". In a world that is rapidly accelerating back into fascism, not using it is definitely a choice! Early 20th century Japan was fascist. The re-writing of Japanese history in that time was fascist action done by fascists. I hope that in 100 years people are not lying about our fascists here in 2020s USA. Our fascists are also re-writing history, RIGHT NOW.

        An accurate and also more useful way to say this would have been "the Japanese fascists wrote women out of their history to build up a warrior myth to justify imperial atrocities."

        gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
        gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
        gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #7

        @dirtwizard666 Too true. Fascist indeed. And what underlies fascist movements is the cult of the macho man, the cult of violence. Fascism is a particular sport that men excel at for they wrote all the rules.

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green

          Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

          Half of Japan’s samurai were women, groundbreaking new exhibition at British Museum says
          https://www.independent.co.uk/asia/japan/british-museum-samurai-women-warrior-myth-b2913476.html

          The Viking Woman Warrior of Birka, Sweden
          https://www.history-channel.org/a-viking-mystery-the-woman-warrior-of-birka/

          Early Women Were Hunters, Not Just Gatherers
          https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/

          ‘Woman the hunter’: Studies aim to correct history
          https://news.nd.edu/news/woman-the-hunter-studies-aim-to-correct-history/

          The sports where women outperform men
          https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240731-the-sports-where-women-outperform-men

          gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
          gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
          gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #8

          Scáthach, legendary Scottish warrior woman who trained legendary Ulster hero Cú Chulainn

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sc%C3%A1thach

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG gimulnautti@mastodon.green

            @gerrymcgovern And MAGA is the force trying to rewrite history again.

            I’m quite sure this happens again and again and again. Because that’s the nature of dominance hierarchy behaviour.

            Co-operative people, egalitarian people, build. Then the dominators show up and pretend like they built it.

            clfh@mastodon.greenC This user is from outside of this forum
            clfh@mastodon.greenC This user is from outside of this forum
            clfh@mastodon.green
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #9

            @gimulnautti Or the dominators extract rent where they can and 'liquidate' community-built assets where they can't.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green

              Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

              Half of Japan’s samurai were women, groundbreaking new exhibition at British Museum says
              https://www.independent.co.uk/asia/japan/british-museum-samurai-women-warrior-myth-b2913476.html

              The Viking Woman Warrior of Birka, Sweden
              https://www.history-channel.org/a-viking-mystery-the-woman-warrior-of-birka/

              Early Women Were Hunters, Not Just Gatherers
              https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/

              ‘Woman the hunter’: Studies aim to correct history
              https://news.nd.edu/news/woman-the-hunter-studies-aim-to-correct-history/

              The sports where women outperform men
              https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240731-the-sports-where-women-outperform-men

              ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
              ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
              ahltorp@mastodon.nu
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #10

              @gerrymcgovern Many women were warriors, yes, but to say that ”half of samurai were women” is as obvious as saying half of any hereditary group is/was women. Samurai was the social class.

              D shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.comS 2 Replies Last reply
              0
              • ahltorp@mastodon.nuA ahltorp@mastodon.nu

                @gerrymcgovern Many women were warriors, yes, but to say that ”half of samurai were women” is as obvious as saying half of any hereditary group is/was women. Samurai was the social class.

                D This user is from outside of this forum
                D This user is from outside of this forum
                drchaos@sauropods.win
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #11

                @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern Yes. That. And apparently this is lost on many....

                marshray@infosec.exchangeM 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • D drchaos@sauropods.win

                  @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern Yes. That. And apparently this is lost on many....

                  marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
                  marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
                  marshray@infosec.exchange
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #12

                  @drchaos @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern Just deceptive clickbait IMO

                  ahltorp@mastodon.nuA einalex@chaos.socialE 2 Replies Last reply
                  0
                  • gerrymcgovern@mastodon.greenG gerrymcgovern@mastodon.green

                    Modern, scientific man has written women out of history

                    Half of Japan’s samurai were women, groundbreaking new exhibition at British Museum says
                    https://www.independent.co.uk/asia/japan/british-museum-samurai-women-warrior-myth-b2913476.html

                    The Viking Woman Warrior of Birka, Sweden
                    https://www.history-channel.org/a-viking-mystery-the-woman-warrior-of-birka/

                    Early Women Were Hunters, Not Just Gatherers
                    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/

                    ‘Woman the hunter’: Studies aim to correct history
                    https://news.nd.edu/news/woman-the-hunter-studies-aim-to-correct-history/

                    The sports where women outperform men
                    https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240731-the-sports-where-women-outperform-men

                    L This user is from outside of this forum
                    L This user is from outside of this forum
                    luc0x61@mastodon.gamedev.place
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #13

                    @gerrymcgovern Unfortunately, if you read well the article about samurai women, it doesn't recall a role too far from a male-dominated culture.
                    Maybe, what's notable is that our modern, western, patriarchal society inferred that the role of a samurai was male exclusive. This discover then changes our view, but doesn't shake the modern Japanese society.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • ahltorp@mastodon.nuA ahltorp@mastodon.nu

                      @gerrymcgovern Many women were warriors, yes, but to say that ”half of samurai were women” is as obvious as saying half of any hereditary group is/was women. Samurai was the social class.

                      shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.comS This user is from outside of this forum
                      shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.comS This user is from outside of this forum
                      shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.com
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #14

                      @ahltorp except that's not obvious from media featuring samurai. The weapons, armor, attire, tools, and training of samurai women are often left out of historical records and references, which imply these things were relevant only to men.

                      For the same reason, there's a note currently on Wikipedia's "Homosexuality in Japan" page saying, "This article is missing information about female homosexuality in historical Japan."

                      @gerrymcgovern

                      ahltorp@mastodon.nuA 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • marshray@infosec.exchangeM marshray@infosec.exchange

                        @drchaos @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern Just deceptive clickbait IMO

                        ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
                        ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
                        ahltorp@mastodon.nu
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #15

                        @marshray @drchaos @gerrymcgovern Women were regularly educated in fighting, I think that’s quite uncontested, but most were probably educated with a focus on defence, although that’s murkier, and has probably been made murky by misogyny.

                        During the whole Edo period, I would say most samurai focus was on ”appropriate behaviour, etiquette and the right cultural preparation”, regardless of sex. But I’m prepared to be challenged by the course I’m starting tomorrow in Edo era history.

                        marshray@infosec.exchangeM 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • ahltorp@mastodon.nuA ahltorp@mastodon.nu

                          @marshray @drchaos @gerrymcgovern Women were regularly educated in fighting, I think that’s quite uncontested, but most were probably educated with a focus on defence, although that’s murkier, and has probably been made murky by misogyny.

                          During the whole Edo period, I would say most samurai focus was on ”appropriate behaviour, etiquette and the right cultural preparation”, regardless of sex. But I’m prepared to be challenged by the course I’m starting tomorrow in Edo era history.

                          marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
                          marshray@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
                          marshray@infosec.exchange
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #16

                          @ahltorp @drchaos @gerrymcgovern “They were a vital part of the elite order”

                          Look at the original post and consider whether that usage of ‘samurai’ fits with the other four examples given.

                          It’s a shameless motte-and-bailey, clickbait-and-switch, underhanded tactic by The Independent.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.comS shadowfals@mastodon.otherworldsink.com

                            @ahltorp except that's not obvious from media featuring samurai. The weapons, armor, attire, tools, and training of samurai women are often left out of historical records and references, which imply these things were relevant only to men.

                            For the same reason, there's a note currently on Wikipedia's "Homosexuality in Japan" page saying, "This article is missing information about female homosexuality in historical Japan."

                            @gerrymcgovern

                            ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
                            ahltorp@mastodon.nuA This user is from outside of this forum
                            ahltorp@mastodon.nu
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #17

                            @shadowfals @gerrymcgovern From a Japanese perspective, I would say it’s obvious that samurai was a social class, and that the women were as much samurai as the men. Europeans mangling this is their own problem.

                            But then there is the issue of what type of military education and engagement samurai women had, and there I think there are internal Japanese problems in the historical records, based on misogyny.

                            But also, ”samurai” were two very different things before and after 1600.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • marshray@infosec.exchangeM marshray@infosec.exchange

                              @drchaos @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern Just deceptive clickbait IMO

                              einalex@chaos.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
                              einalex@chaos.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
                              einalex@chaos.social
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #18

                              @marshray You're missing the point. The point is not so much "women were warriors" it is "our reductive telling of history* is heavily tilted to disregard most of what is important, and so our idea of what 'samurai' means, is just plain wrong."

                              We're so used to "hero stories" and main characters that we're oblivious to this.

                              *) let's be honest, this is true for the stories we tell today.

                              @drchaos @ahltorp @gerrymcgovern

                              1 Reply Last reply
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