If you're a white person on the Fediverse and you've never seen someone called a slur, or threats made against them--congratulations!

[flesh@transfem.social]

@dave@alvarado.social @flippac@types.pl I am not accusing anyone nor denying the harassment, but it's also worth keeping in mind that screenshots don't really prove anything, especially given how the accounts are sockpuppets.
If one is inclined to believe you, they'll probably believe you when you just say you were harassed. If one's inclined to accuse you of lying, they can easily dismiss screenshots as fabricated.
So the people who "need more proof" are generally not people who are gonna be convinced by it anyway.

[harueb@mk.absturztau.be]

@dave@alvarado.social I feel like I'm missing something here, how does the target see the followers only replies if they don't follow accounts of the harasser(s)? Do people mentioned in followers only posts also see those posts, even though they aren't followers?

[dave@alvarado.social]

@HaruEb because they're directly mentioned, the same as you're directly mentioned here in my reply.

[dave@alvarado.social]

@flesh @flippac I agree, and generally when people are posting screenshots it's in response to "I don't see it so I don't believe it's happening". it's not to accuse a particular sock puppet.

[dave@alvarado.social]

@sibylle the Mastodon team is the right place. They have recently changed their organization some and hired some additional people, so there's a chance the complaint is received more seriously than similar complaints have been received in the past when it was really one man making the decisions.

[dave@alvarado.social]

@dalias @MxAlba yes, this. "Public post but only <my followers and/or people I follow> can reply" would be a huge step in the right direction. It would let you say something to the world without letting the world talk back, but you still get feedback from your friends.

"I want to get this off my chest but I don't want to hear your opinion about it" is not possible in Mastodon today.

[dave@alvarado.social]

@shlee @fishidwardrobe certainly it's harder on the internet where the jerk is out of physical reach.

[dragonfrog@mastodon.sdf.org]

@leeloo @dave that was kind of my thought - each account named would publish the replies for its own followers to see.

But yeah, followers of the OP would
Would work just as well for keeping a thread readable, and preventing someone from invisibly harassing.

[woozle@toot.cat]

@dave OMG THIS EXPLAINS SO MUCH. I knew of the phenomenon ("I'm being abused but nobody else can see it") but not the mechanism.

Thank you much!

[dave@alvarado.social]

@TheJen I actually really love this idea, like setting off an alarm.

[woozle@toot.cat]

@dave

Would this change (in the code/design) be helpful, do you think: for posts that are in reply to something, give the original poster the ability to {reveal publicly, if non-public} and/or {completely delete, for everyone} those replies.

Maybe someone has come up with a better idea, but that's what comes quickly to my mind.

@flippac

[thejen@beige.party]

@dave For one thing, nobody could say "I don't see it" anymore, because it would force it all out in the open. Taking the burden off the victim I think is one of the goals here, yes?

[dave@alvarado.social]

@TheJen yeah, and I think "change this to public" is the sort of thing that has a reasonable chance of working in the federated architecture.

[thejen@beige.party]

@dave Yep. That's what I'm thinking too. Fairly simple fix.

[thejen@beige.party]

@dave TBH, I don't even see it most of the time as I heavily use the block button, but I absolutely believe this is happening. There is also nothing that says you can't use the technology to apply social pressure. If bad actors know they will likely be outed and subject to social consequences, they may think twice.

[dave@alvarado.social]

@gunchleoc @chocobo13 this. You can file issues with Mastodon devs and you can spread the word that this happens and how.

Steal my post in good health or describe the issue in your own words.

[boerps@nrw.social]

@semitones @dave
Willst Du den Scheixx noch verbreiten? Dann ist das hier bald wie X.
Und ein Pranger gehört ins Mittelalter.

[anne_delong@musician.social]

@fishidwardrobe @MxAlba @dave

In order to keep their abuse secret, these harassing accounts would have to use "Request to follow", because otherwise their abuse could be easily exposed by those following them.

I have avoided following anyone with this setting, not wanting to be in a group where others are not welcome. I know this is a weak reason, but now I have a stronger one.

[dave@alvarado.social]

Last post I'm going to make in this thread. If you want more visibility into this underside of the Fediverse, follow the #fediblock hashtag (and send some mental thanks and good vibes to MarciaX while you're at it, you're benefiting from the work of a Black woman).

If you want to do something about this, I know of two things anyone can do:

1. Open or comment on issues at https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/issues

2. Share this info. Steal my posts in good health, or write this issue up in your own words.

[flippac@types.pl]

@woozle @dave (so: first of all, situations where somebody's doing it in good faith like when they'd happily set it to the other person's followers aren't subject to new misbehaviour...

...but also nobody wakes up to an immense volume of shit to shovel overnight)