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  3. A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations.

A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations.

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  • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

    @sl007 "helpful"

    sl007@digitalcourage.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
    sl007@digitalcourage.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
    sl007@digitalcourage.social
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #10

    @tante

    yeah, "helpful" was a month before when it showed me the image I searched for.

    This search returned 0 results and 3 wrong connections 😉

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • pelle@veganism.socialP pelle@veganism.social shared this topic
    • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

      A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations. This is an important step to bring "AI" slop in line with all other products on the market: "AI" products are basically the only ones where a provider can just deliver unchecked garbage and put all the liability on the consumer. I hope to see aggressive change here.

      https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/

      theeclecticdyslexic@mstdn.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
      theeclecticdyslexic@mstdn.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
      theeclecticdyslexic@mstdn.social
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #11

      @tante This is the kind of thing I couldn't have come up with, because I would never have considered what the LLM is spitting out to be Google's words.

      Guess there is no real way out. They get what they wanted and I isn't legally theft (however incompetent)... but now it's their words so guess they are responsible.

      Look forward to how they try to fight this one. Sorry it's not our words, we actually stole the entirety of human creation.

      noodlemaz@mstdn.gamesN 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI iamlayer8@mastodon.social

        @tante
        They could flag it as comedy or satire

        timotimo@peoplemaking.gamesT This user is from outside of this forum
        timotimo@peoplemaking.gamesT This user is from outside of this forum
        timotimo@peoplemaking.games
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #12

        @iamlayer8 @tante "Google AI Overview is for Entertainment Purposes Only" just like ... was it copilot that had this in the terms of use or whatever?

        iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • timotimo@peoplemaking.gamesT timotimo@peoplemaking.games

          @iamlayer8 @tante "Google AI Overview is for Entertainment Purposes Only" just like ... was it copilot that had this in the terms of use or whatever?

          iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
          iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
          iamlayer8@mastodon.social
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #13

          @timotimo
          It should be flagged as AI Slop - on screen, mandated by law.
          Then they can re-define what that means by delivering correct information. And in 5 years we will use #AISlop as an indicator of high quality content.

          @tante

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

            A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations. This is an important step to bring "AI" slop in line with all other products on the market: "AI" products are basically the only ones where a provider can just deliver unchecked garbage and put all the liability on the consumer. I hope to see aggressive change here.

            https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/

            david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
            david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
            david_chisnall@infosec.exchange
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #14

            @tante

            Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

            Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

            That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

            lobingera@chaos.socialL c0dec0dec0de@hachyderm.ioC ozzelot@mstdn.socialO rdp@notpickard.comR mizkirsten@mastodon.socialM 20 Replies Last reply
            1
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            • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

              @tante

              Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

              Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

              That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

              lobingera@chaos.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
              lobingera@chaos.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
              lobingera@chaos.social
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #15

              @david_chisnall @tante

              iirc, Google said that earlier about their search results, also.

              markotway@mastodonapp.ukM 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • mjack@mastodon.bsd.cafeM mjack@mastodon.bsd.cafe shared this topic
              • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                @tante

                Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                c0dec0dec0de@hachyderm.ioC This user is from outside of this forum
                c0dec0dec0de@hachyderm.ioC This user is from outside of this forum
                c0dec0dec0de@hachyderm.io
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #16

                @david_chisnall @tante this is also known as the Fox “News” defense for those in the US

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                  @tante

                  Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                  Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                  That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                  ozzelot@mstdn.socialO This user is from outside of this forum
                  ozzelot@mstdn.socialO This user is from outside of this forum
                  ozzelot@mstdn.social
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #17

                  @david_chisnall
                  Imagine TI saying that about their calculators.
                  @tante

                  iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                    @tante

                    Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                    Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                    That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                    rdp@notpickard.comR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rdp@notpickard.comR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rdp@notpickard.com
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #18

                    @david_chisnall @tante cigarettes?

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • lobingera@chaos.socialL lobingera@chaos.social

                      @david_chisnall @tante

                      iirc, Google said that earlier about their search results, also.

                      markotway@mastodonapp.ukM This user is from outside of this forum
                      markotway@mastodonapp.ukM This user is from outside of this forum
                      markotway@mastodonapp.uk
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #19

                      @lobingera
                      Slightly different. "search results you see may not be the most relevant for your query" is very different to "We're providing actual information which has a reasonably likelihood of being wrong, and potentially dangerously wrong".
                      @david_chisnall @tante

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                        @tante

                        Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                        Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                        That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                        mizkirsten@mastodon.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        mizkirsten@mastodon.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        mizkirsten@mastodon.social
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #20

                        @david_chisnall @tante

                        What's the difference between an LLM and a pack of cigarettes?

                        They both fill the room with smoke that will eventually kill someone. But cigarettes come with a warning.

                        iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                          @tante

                          Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                          Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                          That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                          robotistry@fediscience.orgR This user is from outside of this forum
                          robotistry@fediscience.orgR This user is from outside of this forum
                          robotistry@fediscience.org
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #21

                          @david_chisnall @tante Remember when Intel released a chip with a built in floating point math error that happened one nine-billionth of the time?

                          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                            @tante

                            Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                            Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                            That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                            jernej__s@infosec.exchangeJ This user is from outside of this forum
                            jernej__s@infosec.exchangeJ This user is from outside of this forum
                            jernej__s@infosec.exchange
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #22

                            @david_chisnall @tante Don't forget that Copilot is for entertainment purposes only, too.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                              @tante

                              Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                              Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                              That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                              nukleos@mendeddrum.orgN This user is from outside of this forum
                              nukleos@mendeddrum.orgN This user is from outside of this forum
                              nukleos@mendeddrum.org
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #23

                              @david_chisnall

                              @tante

                              I know a few people who won´t like this admission from Google: "the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and users should know that" !!

                              Will OpenAI e.a. admit the same thing?

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                @tante

                                Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                                Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                                That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                                sebastian@mastodon.ccS This user is from outside of this forum
                                sebastian@mastodon.ccS This user is from outside of this forum
                                sebastian@mastodon.cc
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #24

                                @david_chisnall @tante

                                Indeed no other industry or product could get away with that ... - let us just hope that this court's view is upheld through future instances

                                eestileib@tech.lgbtE sebastian@social.itu.dkS 2 Replies Last reply
                                0
                                • sebastian@social.itu.dkS sebastian@social.itu.dk shared this topic
                                • ozzelot@mstdn.socialO ozzelot@mstdn.social

                                  @david_chisnall
                                  Imagine TI saying that about their calculators.
                                  @tante

                                  iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                  iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                  iamlayer8@mastodon.social
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #25

                                  @ozzelot
                                  I remember Microsoft successfully lobbying to keep known faulty behavior like handling the year 1900 as a leap year in the OOXML standard.

                                  So that idea is not that far off for me.

                                  @david_chisnall @tante

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • mizkirsten@mastodon.socialM mizkirsten@mastodon.social

                                    @david_chisnall @tante

                                    What's the difference between an LLM and a pack of cigarettes?

                                    They both fill the room with smoke that will eventually kill someone. But cigarettes come with a warning.

                                    iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                    iamlayer8@mastodon.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                    iamlayer8@mastodon.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #26

                                    @mizkirsten
                                    Finally

                                    @david_chisnall @tante

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                      A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations. This is an important step to bring "AI" slop in line with all other products on the market: "AI" products are basically the only ones where a provider can just deliver unchecked garbage and put all the liability on the consumer. I hope to see aggressive change here.

                                      https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/

                                      xs4me2@mastodon.socialX This user is from outside of this forum
                                      xs4me2@mastodon.socialX This user is from outside of this forum
                                      xs4me2@mastodon.social
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #27

                                      @tante

                                      Excellent verdict, actions have consequences…

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                        A court in Munich declared that Google is liable for their "AI summaries" and all its hallucinations. This is an important step to bring "AI" slop in line with all other products on the market: "AI" products are basically the only ones where a provider can just deliver unchecked garbage and put all the liability on the consumer. I hope to see aggressive change here.

                                        https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/

                                        perrynoid@defcon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        perrynoid@defcon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        perrynoid@defcon.social
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #28

                                        @tante

                                        Hallucinations aren't Google's fault, and they can't just fix them. It's a property of AI. So just don't use it for topics you don't understand. And frankly, I don't know anyone who still uses Google. Even my mom uses DuckDuckGo.

                                        landa@graz.socialL 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                          @tante

                                          Google's defence needs to be amplified by anyone talking to politicians about 'AI' regulation:

                                          Google is explicitly saying in their legal filing that the outputs from their LLM should not be trusted and that users should know that.

                                          That's one hell of an admission. Imagine saying that about any other category of product.

                                          edavies@functional.cafeE This user is from outside of this forum
                                          edavies@functional.cafeE This user is from outside of this forum
                                          edavies@functional.cafe
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #29

                                          @david_chisnall Don't most software licences, particularly FOSS ones, say that?

                                          @tante

                                          david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD 1 Reply Last reply
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