So i’ve been wondering about how Israel’s Eurovision song won the popular vote in Eurovision 2025.
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Researching a bit I found that Israel had been running a massive propaganda campaign online and even running ads on Times Square. See e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99qbE0HENG0. I guess that could explain it, but it hardly seems enough to make such a hard sell.
Eurovision voting thread 2/12 -
Then I remembered how the voting mechanism worked. Every voter has 20 votes. And you can vote on 20 different songs or on one song 20 times, or everything in between. Now this is interesting, this means fanatics get an outsize influence. Let me explain ...
Eurovision voting thread 3/12 -
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Then I remembered how the voting mechanism worked. Every voter has 20 votes. And you can vote on 20 different songs or on one song 20 times, or everything in between. Now this is interesting, this means fanatics get an outsize influence. Let me explain ...
Eurovision voting thread 3/12 -
Lets say that our voting group is heavily polarized. One minority is fanatically voting for their one song, they always cast 20 votes on that one song. The majority, though, are really against these fanatics, and will never vote for that one song. There are 25 other songs, so they divide their votes according to their taste. See where this is going?
Eurovision voting thread 4/12 -
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Lets say that our voting group is heavily polarized. One minority is fanatically voting for their one song, they always cast 20 votes on that one song. The majority, though, are really against these fanatics, and will never vote for that one song. There are 25 other songs, so they divide their votes according to their taste. See where this is going?
Eurovision voting thread 4/12 -
Let's run a simple thought experiment to explore this. Let's say there are a 1000 voters. 1% percent are the fanatics. They always vote 20 votes on Israel. 99% percent never vote for Israel. They divide their vote among the other 25 contestants.
Eurovision voting thread 5/12-
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Let's run a simple thought experiment to explore this. Let's say there are a 1000 voters. 1% percent are the fanatics. They always vote 20 votes on Israel. 99% percent never vote for Israel. They divide their vote among the other 25 contestants.
Eurovision voting thread 5/12-
Just for simplicity, let's says they divide their votes equally. 99% is 990 voters. They have a total of 19.800 votes. Divided equally among the 25 other contestants. That is 792 votes for each non-israeli song. 1% percent fanatics cast 200 votes for Israel. So far so good.
Eurovision voting thread 6/12 -
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Just for simplicity, let's says they divide their votes equally. 99% is 990 voters. They have a total of 19.800 votes. Divided equally among the 25 other contestants. That is 792 votes for each non-israeli song. 1% percent fanatics cast 200 votes for Israel. So far so good.
Eurovision voting thread 6/12 -
Now what if there are 4% fanatics? Then Israel gets 800 votes. The remaining 96% will divide their votes among the 25 other songs, giving each 768 votes each. Vuppetidu Israel won the popular vote of the Eurovision Song contest. Even though only 4% actually voted for them. This is potentially an enormous propaganda victory.
Eurovision voting thread 7/12 -
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Now what if there are 4% fanatics? Then Israel gets 800 votes. The remaining 96% will divide their votes among the 25 other songs, giving each 768 votes each. Vuppetidu Israel won the popular vote of the Eurovision Song contest. Even though only 4% actually voted for them. This is potentially an enormous propaganda victory.
Eurovision voting thread 7/12 -
Now looking at the massive campaign Israel ran for their Eurovision song as a kind of information warfare, makes more sense. The around 240 million viewers globally are left with the sense that Israel is immensely popular, and that if you are against the genocide, then you are alone. All the rest of the world supports Israel, and you might start to doubt yourself.
@Eurovision voting thread 8/12 -
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Now looking at the massive campaign Israel ran for their Eurovision song as a kind of information warfare, makes more sense. The around 240 million viewers globally are left with the sense that Israel is immensely popular, and that if you are against the genocide, then you are alone. All the rest of the world supports Israel, and you might start to doubt yourself.
@Eurovision voting thread 8/12 -
Looking again at the youtube video I posted earlier, it reads very clearly. It's posted by Stand With Us, a right-wing zionist organization in the US (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StandWithUs). In the description they write: "Eurovision is about more than music — it’s a moment to stand with Israel on a global stage."
Eurovision voting thread 9/12 -
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Looking again at the youtube video I posted earlier, it reads very clearly. It's posted by Stand With Us, a right-wing zionist organization in the US (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StandWithUs). In the description they write: "Eurovision is about more than music — it’s a moment to stand with Israel on a global stage."
Eurovision voting thread 9/12 -
And then: "Cast up to 20 votes per device - every vote counts! Just a few easy steps to show your support." They even add: "Live in the U.S.? No problem: Here's how to vote .." followed by a link to voting instructions. Yes countries outside the contest, can also vote. They are given weight of one country, according to the EBU.
Eurovision voting thread 10/12 -
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And then: "Cast up to 20 votes per device - every vote counts! Just a few easy steps to show your support." They even add: "Live in the U.S.? No problem: Here's how to vote .." followed by a link to voting instructions. Yes countries outside the contest, can also vote. They are given weight of one country, according to the EBU.
Eurovision voting thread 10/12 -
In the end of the youtube video description, is the sentence: "
: Courtesy of the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Israeli Consulate in New York." So there you have it, plain as day. Israel just fucked up the greatest song contest in the world, and made everyone believe they were popular. So what can we do about it? I'm not sure - I would love for the EBU to release detailed voting results, so we could confirm or deny this gaming of the system. But don't count on it.thread 11/12 -
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In the end of the youtube video description, is the sentence: "
: Courtesy of the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Israeli Consulate in New York." So there you have it, plain as day. Israel just fucked up the greatest song contest in the world, and made everyone believe they were popular. So what can we do about it? I'm not sure - I would love for the EBU to release detailed voting results, so we could confirm or deny this gaming of the system. But don't count on it.thread 11/12 -
But what would be good was to spread this line of questioning and analysis far and wide - to say aloud - NO - ISRAEL IS NOT THE MOST POPULAR EUROVISION COUNTRY - THEY ARE COMMITING GENOCIDE AND USING THEIR STATE MONEY TO LIE ABOUT IT IN THE EUROVISION SONG CONTEST. And to end off I would like to point you all to the Boycut, Divest and Sanction movement: https://bdsmovement.net/
Eurovision voting thread 12/12 -
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But what would be good was to spread this line of questioning and analysis far and wide - to say aloud - NO - ISRAEL IS NOT THE MOST POPULAR EUROVISION COUNTRY - THEY ARE COMMITING GENOCIDE AND USING THEIR STATE MONEY TO LIE ABOUT IT IN THE EUROVISION SONG CONTEST. And to end off I would like to point you all to the Boycut, Divest and Sanction movement: https://bdsmovement.net/
Eurovision voting thread 12/12 -
Update 1: Spanish television and EBU member is also finding it weird: https://www.dr.dk/nyheder/kultur/tv-stationer-vil-have-undersoegt-stemmeafgivelsen-ved-eurovision (in danish) -
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A abekonge@venner.network shared this topic
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So i’ve been wondering about how Israel’s Eurovision song won the popular vote in Eurovision 2025. Their song was weak and Israel is commiting genocide and a lot of people think they should be boycut from the contest. So what the hell just happened, (to quote the British Eurovision song).
Eurovision voting thread 1/12 -
@abekonge I'd say make the public vote exactly like the juries do: rank all songs from best to worst -- only once. That should give a more balanced distribution of points and discourage voters who didn't watch.
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Then I remembered how the voting mechanism worked. Every voter has 20 votes. And you can vote on 20 different songs or on one song 20 times, or everything in between. Now this is interesting, this means fanatics get an outsize influence. Let me explain ...
Eurovision voting thread 3/12 -
@abekonge Where is part 4 and forward?
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Then I remembered how the voting mechanism worked. Every voter has 20 votes. And you can vote on 20 different songs or on one song 20 times, or everything in between. Now this is interesting, this means fanatics get an outsize influence. Let me explain ...
Eurovision voting thread 3/12 -
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Lets say that our voting group is heavily polarized. One minority is fanatically voting for their one song, they always cast 20 votes on that one song. The majority, though, are really against these fanatics, and will never vote for that one song. There are 25 other songs, so they divide their votes according to their taste. See where this is going?
Eurovision voting thread 4/12 -
@malte here
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Let's run a simple thought experiment to explore this. Let's say there are a 1000 voters. 1% percent are the fanatics. They always vote 20 votes on Israel. 99% percent never vote for Israel. They divide their vote among the other 25 contestants.
Eurovision voting thread 5/12-
@malte and here
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@abekonge Where is part 4 and forward?
@malte We had some connection issues when i posted this. Did my “quoting” just now help?
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M malte@radikal.social shared this topic
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But what would be good was to spread this line of questioning and analysis far and wide - to say aloud - NO - ISRAEL IS NOT THE MOST POPULAR EUROVISION COUNTRY - THEY ARE COMMITING GENOCIDE AND USING THEIR STATE MONEY TO LIE ABOUT IT IN THE EUROVISION SONG CONTEST. And to end off I would like to point you all to the Boycut, Divest and Sanction movement: https://bdsmovement.net/
Eurovision voting thread 12/12 -
@abekonge We need an actual thread or blog post so we can boost the whole thing. Great work pointing out this perception management.
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@abekonge We need an actual thread or blog post so we can boost the whole thing. Great work pointing out this perception management.
@malte I’ll try to repost it. Thanks.
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@malte We had some connection issues when i posted this. Did my “quoting” just now help?
@abekonge only for the very next bit
