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  3. Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP).

Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP).

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  • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

    Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

    Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

    Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

    I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

    eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
    eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
    eowyn@pouet.chapril.org
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #28

    @david_chisnall this! Begin with firefox, then LibreOffice and whatever application you need.
    Then when you switch to linux you already know the applications.

    eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

      Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

      Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

      Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

      I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

      davep@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
      davep@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
      davep@infosec.exchange
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #29

      @david_chisnall I was technical lead for a customer Y2K migration to NT4.0 including over 900 applications.

      It was a huge job but we managed it. It would have been way easier doing it as you suggest and without the impending time constraints that we had.

      The rationale and stack are different, but I think the same principles apply.

      1 Reply Last reply
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      • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

        Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

        Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

        Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

        I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

        mmu_man@m.g3l.orgM This user is from outside of this forum
        mmu_man@m.g3l.orgM This user is from outside of this forum
        mmu_man@m.g3l.org
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #30

        @david_chisnall that's what the French gendarmerie did, took them 10 years, but they saved millions.

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE eowyn@pouet.chapril.org

          @david_chisnall this! Begin with firefox, then LibreOffice and whatever application you need.
          Then when you switch to linux you already know the applications.

          eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
          eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
          eowyn@pouet.chapril.org
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #31

          @david_chisnall for organisations, first install linux on an old extra computer (do this instead of throwing away 3 years old PC) so people can test it and familiarise themselves with it.

          david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

            Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

            Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

            Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

            I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

            jarno@dosgame.clubJ This user is from outside of this forum
            jarno@dosgame.clubJ This user is from outside of this forum
            jarno@dosgame.club
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #32

            @david_chisnall that’s actually very sound advice. Haven’t heard it being given before actually. Also sounds very logical.

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • eowyn@pouet.chapril.orgE eowyn@pouet.chapril.org

              @david_chisnall for organisations, first install linux on an old extra computer (do this instead of throwing away 3 years old PC) so people can test it and familiarise themselves with it.

              david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
              david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD This user is from outside of this forum
              david_chisnall@infosec.exchange
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #33

              @eowyn

              Especially if you've got some centralised login system and file server (or cloudy equivalents), where you can get your desktop from different computers. You can set up the Linux machine to allow access to the same files and, mostly, the same apps.

              The danger of using an old machine for this is that people are likely to think Linux is slow because they're using Windows on this year's machines and Linux on the old ones (three years is optimistic: I think the last time I saw a company doing three-year rolling upgrades was over 20 years ago, most places seem to have moved to seven-year or 'when it wears out' policies).

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                L This user is from outside of this forum
                L This user is from outside of this forum
                lotv@social.vivaldi.net
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #34

                @david_chisnall
                Our workplace decided to free themselves from Microsoft licenses and rolled out openoffice across the board. Except they never updated it to assure interoperability with MS Office users. Then they made exceptions for folk who needed excel because of macros, then people who had to send a lot of docs to other places then people who complained because him at the next desk had "real" office. Eventually the whole initiative just fell apart.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                  Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                  Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                  Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                  I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                  lrt_writes@mstdn.partyL This user is from outside of this forum
                  lrt_writes@mstdn.partyL This user is from outside of this forum
                  lrt_writes@mstdn.party
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #35

                  @david_chisnall good advice! I switched to Libre Office. I'm not yet as proficient with it as I was with ms office, but I'm getting there, and I like it.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                    Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                    Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                    Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                    I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                    ledeuns@bsd.networkL This user is from outside of this forum
                    ledeuns@bsd.networkL This user is from outside of this forum
                    ledeuns@bsd.network
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #36

                    @david_chisnall From my experience, not migrating the OS first is too much of a tentation to go back to your "usual" tools at the first friction.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • timothyroes@mastodon.socialT timothyroes@mastodon.social

                      @david_chisnall This is such great advice. I think that's how the French police managed it in the early 2000's. They first switched users to LibreOffice. It's also what made me switch. I first got into the command line on macOS, then felt comfortable to make the switch.

                      gugux@framapiaf.orgG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gugux@framapiaf.orgG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gugux@framapiaf.org
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #37

                      @TimothyRoes
                      Not the police but the Gendarmerie, but the difference is not relevant here.
                      400.000 users migrated and millions of public money saved.
                      And other administrations start or plan to do the same.
                      Thank you Trump !
                      @david_chisnall

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                        @heiglandreas

                        Yup, the transition from macOS is harder because OS X was consistent and tightly integrated, from the command-line up through the GUI.

                        When we were doing Étoilé, I joked that F/OSS DEs would pass OS X usability in 20 years even if the F/OSS people didn't change anything, just due to the rate at which OS X was getting worse. I think Apple's been doing their best to make that prediction true in the last couple of releases.

                        heiglandreas@phpc.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                        heiglandreas@phpc.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                        heiglandreas@phpc.social
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #38

                        @david_chisnall Oh absolutely! 😁

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • hnapel@mastodon.socialH hnapel@mastodon.social

                          @david_chisnall

                          I mainly maintain my Windows (game) computers because of the games / steam currently runs best on Windows, if Steam and NVidia (and perhaps AMD) get their act together I would be happy to change tack, for everything else (besides work) I use the Linux already.

                          razemix@mamutovo.czR This user is from outside of this forum
                          razemix@mamutovo.czR This user is from outside of this forum
                          razemix@mamutovo.cz
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #39

                          @hnapel @david_chisnall What games do you play? Is any of them broken on Linux if you check ProtonDB? Nvidia for the most parts works fine already on Linux. (I run Pop OS with RTX 2070 Super and I've had no problems so far.)

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                            Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                            Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                            Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                            I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                            G This user is from outside of this forum
                            G This user is from outside of this forum
                            gotta@infosec.exchange
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #40

                            @david_chisnall good advice! Is there a "quitting smoking" parallel somewhere in there?

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                              Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                              Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                              Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                              I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                              razemix@mamutovo.czR This user is from outside of this forum
                              razemix@mamutovo.czR This user is from outside of this forum
                              razemix@mamutovo.cz
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #41

                              @david_chisnall Yup, worked for me. The only thing I miss is Notepad++, but KWrite is a good enough replacement. It fortunately also worked for my wife. Even on Windows, she already used LibreOffice, Audacity and MuseScore. The only last-minute change was swapping Chrome for Firefox, but thet went pretty smoothly too. So now we are a completely Windows-free household. 😄

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                                Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                                Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                                I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                                G This user is from outside of this forum
                                G This user is from outside of this forum
                                grepe@ieji.de
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #42

                                @david_chisnall on one hand this makes lot of sense, on the other this makes the app switch worse. many apps that work on windows work there slightly differently and often are actually harder to use... which can be a deal breaker for people who are not sure about the entire thing (those who really want to make the switch will find the way one way or the other). as an example try to use something like darktable on windows.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                  Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                                  Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                                  Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                                  I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                                  nfk@digitalcourage.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
                                  nfk@digitalcourage.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
                                  nfk@digitalcourage.social
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #43

                                  @david_chisnall

                                  2025 Schleswig-Holstein switched to Open Xchange, Thunderbird, LibreOffice and Nextcloud

                                  2026 Schleswig-Holstein started to switch from windows to Linux 💪

                                  #SchleswigHolstein #openxchange #Thunderbird #LibreOffice #linux

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • bluetea@ioc.exchangeB bluetea@ioc.exchange

                                    @Brett_E_Carlock @david_chisnall I've been giving similar advice. Start by installing Libre Office and learning to use that. Get Firefox or another browser. Many of the major FLOSS programs provide Windows versions. (as you note)

                                    joeinwynnewood@mstdn.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                    joeinwynnewood@mstdn.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                    joeinwynnewood@mstdn.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #44

                                    @bluetea

                                    I'm at the beginning of the transition using Libre, Vivaldi and Firefox, Proton email and slowly migrating to their calendar (missing important stuff like tasks), but struggling to figure out what to use to replace Outlook.
                                    As much as I hate Microsoft, Outlook's functionality still seems head and shoulders above alternatives (especially with Proton Mail Bridge not handling 3rd party calendar access).

                                    @Brett_E_Carlock @david_chisnall

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                      Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                                      Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                                      Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                                      I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                                      smeg@assortedflotsam.comS This user is from outside of this forum
                                      smeg@assortedflotsam.comS This user is from outside of this forum
                                      smeg@assortedflotsam.com
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #45

                                      @david_chisnall then some drone in Finance comes to you with some subscription Excel vbs macro + application that requires so many old Windows dependencies that you want to cry, and of course you can't port that. And that team gets to keep Windows and Office. Then everyone else wants it, too, because they don't want to adapt to anything new, ever.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                        Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                                        Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                                        Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                                        I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                                        radoraccoon@pounced-on.meR This user is from outside of this forum
                                        radoraccoon@pounced-on.meR This user is from outside of this forum
                                        radoraccoon@pounced-on.me
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #46

                                        @david_chisnall This is exactly what made my Linux transition smooth - ever since Windows 11 came out (a bit before, even), I've been making an effort to slowly switch my Windows-only apps for open source or at least Linux-compatible alternatives - RawTherapee replaced Adobe Lightroom, Davinci Resolve replaced Adobe Premiere, stuff like that.

                                        So, when a few months ago Windows 11 pissd me off so much that I finally decided I was done with it, switching to Linux felt like a breeze - all my apps still worked, but the OS also worked.

                                        It definitely was not seamless (I would describe the experience as seamful, in fact) - but not needing to replace all my applications at the same time made it 10x smoother

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • david_chisnall@infosec.exchangeD david_chisnall@infosec.exchange

                                          Almost 25 years ago, I wrote a blog post with the title ‘jumping ship slowly’ about leaving Windows (XP was awful, it was mind boggling to me that Vista managed to make people nostalgic for XP). My advice remains the same:

                                          Don’t try switching OS first. The OS is the most easily replaceable bit in the stack. Switch applications first. Most ‘Linux’ apps are cross platform. They’ll run on Windows, and the few that don’t will run in WSL2. You can switch out apps one at a time, and take the time to get comfortable with the alternatives.

                                          Once you’re comfortable not using any Windows-only apps, changing the OS but using all of the same applications is very easy to do. Changing OS and application stack at the same time is an enormous obstacle.

                                          I believe this is also why a lot of corporate and government Linux migrations fail: they try to change everything at the same time and that’s too steep a learning curve.

                                          placebo@mastodon.ieP This user is from outside of this forum
                                          placebo@mastodon.ieP This user is from outside of this forum
                                          placebo@mastodon.ie
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #47

                                          @david_chisnall I like the logic behind this, but at the same time, I noticed that LibreOffice and GIMP take much more time to open on Windows and macOS. That can discourage some users, so it's probably better to communicate this with them in advance.

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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