I have been warning about the term "digital sovereignty" and how it is right-wing coded and probably can't be salvaged for non-right-wing politics.

[kejster@mastodon.world]

@jwildeboer @tante Same here. Autonomy is a much better term.

[mediocreman@mastodon.social]

@tante

Tante, thanks for that interesting, and worrying, perspective. A good idea high-jacked by the undesirables.

[datenwolf@chaos.social]

@kejster @jwildeboer @tante

It's also a lot more accurate (IMHO) with respect to what the actual goals are/should be.

[heliograph@mastodon.au]

@tante it had real meaning to it you know, nothing imperialistic but a distinct position already described

[skyglobe@hostux.social]

@jwildeboer @tante I was thinking about "digital indipendence" but then I thought about the right wing militias and the whole prepper movement.

[nilz@norden.social]

@tante @jwildeboer

Fascists will adopt whatever terms we use.

So, maybe we should always add, to every term, the word: "antifascist"

We want antifascist digital souvereignity.

[danielscardoso@scholar.social]

I usually see it used as "data sovereignty", in the sense of material control over data. Thanks for the new insight!

[hamishcampbell@mastodon.social]

@tante its mess we do need to practically compost https://hamishcampbell.com/digital-sovereignty-is-more-mess-we-need-to-compost/

[davidgerard@circumstances.run]

@tante yeah, I can't see it without thinking of the crypto guy usage of the term

[algernon@come-from.mad-scientist.club]

@tante FWIW, Hungary's Fidesz (also a far-right fascist party) is also a big champion of (national) sovereignty. So are many other right-wing parties of the Patriots of Europe group of the EU Parliament.

Heck, AfD - along with a bunch of other parties even further to the right - are part of the Europe of Sovereign Nations Group.

That word is very, very right-wing coded indeed.

[hadon@mastodon.social]

@tante

It's not a right-wing term, it is a legal term.

[hadon@mastodon.social]

@jwildeboer @tante

Well, for what I understand, sovereignty and autonomy are not equivalent.
Sovereignty is a more legal sort of term and stronger than autonomy. Autonomy is part of sovereignty but the opposite is not true. I mean, in order to attain sovereignty you need autonomy, it defines it.

https://www-sciencedirect-com.translate.goog/topics/social-sciences/sovereignty?_x_tr_sl=en&_x_tr_tl=fr&_x_tr_hl=fr&_x_tr_pto=rq

[tante@tldr.nettime.org]

@hadon it's both

[ebel@moytura.org]

@tante lots of brexit campaining in the UK was about “sovereignty”

[lyrial@transfem.social]

@tante@tldr.nettime.org I think it can be salvaged, simply by copy-left projects ignoring fascists. The sad, part, though is that there are way too many Nazi OSS projects out there

[fabio@zirk.us]

@tante I think it's more than just the term. Replacing American corporations with corporations of a different nationality is not a progressive project. That's what the liberal elites mean when they say "digital sovereignty" and it's fully compatible with fascist concepts of sovereignty.

[beandreams@friendhole.social]

@tante It's a real bummer, because another big use of the term is in Indigenous data sovereignty, where "sovereignty" has a long-running anti-colonial meaning and denotes some very good technology governance principles

[siroj42@troet.cafe]

@tante I've been thinking the same. Digital sovereignty as a term is also very amenable to becoming digital campism, where technologies are preferred just because they are from the EU. Also this: https://troet.cafe/@Siroj42/116080748677182334
Whether it's the sovereignty of a king or "the people", I'd prefer a world without it!

[bsdphk@fosstodon.org]

@tante

I insist on calling it "Digital self-determination" for that and other reasons.

[mxalba@blahaj.zone]

@tante@tldr.nettime.org

Would digital independence be better?