had dinner last night with a couple of kids from Texas and their assessment is that the education system is completely fucked.
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@peter no billionaire has done that to us. We do that to ourselves
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@peter The reason this is happening is ChatGPT is a perfect fit to what the education systems has demanded all along, which is busywork for the sake of busywork, lengthy writings that hold no meaning, time-consuming assignments that serve no purpose.
LLMs are *great* for this! It's not that they've fundamentally messed up the system that was, it's that their presence is shining a spotlight on how shitty it's always been.
@ariarhythmic @peter Actually good point. Schools have to be made more fun too, and teach why learning things is important.
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@DBG3D @ariarhythmic @peter yes we need to make examples.
@f4grx @DBG3D@masto.es @peter Is it the 21st century or the negative 21st?
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@f4grx @DBG3D@masto.es @peter Is it the 21st century or the negative 21st?
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Reality has a liberal bias.
A liberal is a conservative who's been mugged by reality.
In the US, the schooling system is designed to squash liberals and empower reactionary fabulists. I'm saying to fix the schools, not abandon them.
I'm not a "defund the police" guy either, despite being fully aware of how shitty they are. Law and order are necessary. Without it, power devolves to the biggest bastard with the most guns. I'm just saying there's a better way, and it's not like the better way is any kind of a secret. As a species, we know all the answers to create an educated, safe, equitable, sustainable society. It's just that things like forced schooling sabotage any ability to achieve that.
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@ariarhythmic @peter yes. I'm the most horrible person you can imagine, and even more. Obviously.
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@ariarhythmic @peter yes. I'm the most horrible person you can imagine, and even more. Obviously.
@f4grx @peter Didn't we figure out murdering political opponents in death camps was bad in the 1940s? Did you forget?
Or is your point that instead of removing oppressive systems, you want to be placed in charge of them? Didn't we learn how that works out with the tyrannical regimes of the Soviet Union and now the PRC?
Or have you never bothered to? -
had dinner last night with a couple of kids from Texas and their assessment is that the education system is completely fucked. it's all teachers using ChatGPT to make lessons that kids complete using ChatGPT and then teachers grade the work using ChatGPT. you couldn't undermine a society more effectively if you set out to do it on purpose.
@peter Back to hand writing!
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@ariarhythmic @peter Actually good point. Schools have to be made more fun too, and teach why learning things is important.
@Azarilh @ariarhythmic @peter I ran into a surprising manifestation of this when I was in high school in the 2010s, which I assume happened due to some shift in guidelines. Suddenly everything was about critical thinking! Critical thinking is a good skill yes. But nobody even bothered to explain what it was. How it works. How you go about training it. They just expected everyone to have it from the off. And while I may or may not have it, can you explain to me how the fuck you define it? I was a very confused autist.
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@peter Back to hand writing!
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had dinner last night with a couple of kids from Texas and their assessment is that the education system is completely fucked. it's all teachers using ChatGPT to make lessons that kids complete using ChatGPT and then teachers grade the work using ChatGPT. you couldn't undermine a society more effectively if you set out to do it on purpose.
@peter What makes you think this is not the purpose, or at least an intentional consequence?
The less informed, the less capable of independent thought, the easier to subject.
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@Azarilh @ariarhythmic @peter I ran into a surprising manifestation of this when I was in high school in the 2010s, which I assume happened due to some shift in guidelines. Suddenly everything was about critical thinking! Critical thinking is a good skill yes. But nobody even bothered to explain what it was. How it works. How you go about training it. They just expected everyone to have it from the off. And while I may or may not have it, can you explain to me how the fuck you define it? I was a very confused autist.
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@peter The reason this is happening is ChatGPT is a perfect fit to what the education systems has demanded all along, which is busywork for the sake of busywork, lengthy writings that hold no meaning, time-consuming assignments that serve no purpose.
LLMs are *great* for this! It's not that they've fundamentally messed up the system that was, it's that their presence is shining a spotlight on how shitty it's always been.
@ariarhythmic @peter I’m not an expert on our educational system as a whole, but my wife is a teacher, and this doesn't reflect her commitment to teaching at all. She puts a lot of work into her lesson plans, assignments and grading. Based on some of her student evaluations and comments on sites like Rate my Professor, it's clear that some students won't give her methods a chance and write her assignments off as pointless.
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@f4grx @peter Didn't we figure out murdering political opponents in death camps was bad in the 1940s? Did you forget?
Or is your point that instead of removing oppressive systems, you want to be placed in charge of them? Didn't we learn how that works out with the tyrannical regimes of the Soviet Union and now the PRC?
Or have you never bothered to?@ariarhythmic @f4grx @peter
There was a notable difference between the death camps and the Nuremberg trials. -
@ariarhythmic @peter I’m not an expert on our educational system as a whole, but my wife is a teacher, and this doesn't reflect her commitment to teaching at all. She puts a lot of work into her lesson plans, assignments and grading. Based on some of her student evaluations and comments on sites like Rate my Professor, it's clear that some students won't give her methods a chance and write her assignments off as pointless.
@cj @ariarhythmic i hate the practice of rating teachers, as if students are consumers to be served rather than people to be educated.
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had dinner last night with a couple of kids from Texas and their assessment is that the education system is completely fucked. it's all teachers using ChatGPT to make lessons that kids complete using ChatGPT and then teachers grade the work using ChatGPT. you couldn't undermine a society more effectively if you set out to do it on purpose.
@peter Sooner or later, this was going to happen with Ford-model pedagogy. Modern pedagogy showed a different education is possible, but powers that be wanted schools, esp. public ones, to remain a mere factory of obedient workers
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@Azarilh @ariarhythmic @peter
After Mussolini was hanged up, it changed Franco's mind and near ded he decided to name King Juan Carlos to put Spain into democracy (kind of, the system we got was for the Borbons to keep stealing).So, yes, it works. I'm sure there are many other examples.
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@theothersimo @ariarhythmic @peter
Thats why we need politicians that will not bend to them, and will not tax them. Politicians and judges that will put them in jail.
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@peter No public executions.
Making a show of executing your enemies when you've already won is meaningless violence. Get above that, it's the 21st century in case you haven't noticed.
@ariarhythmic @peter
So, its ok for them to kill us, then?
