Men, *please* go and read this blogpost by @girlonthenet:
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I hope no one on this chat has experience rape. I know of two who have and I'm sure there are sadly more of my friends who have gone through the horrific ordeal but have never reported it or told their friends/family.
Having grown up in the 70-60s I've lived through the socially acceptable years of telling horrible/nasty racist jokes along with misogynistic/rape ones.
I live in hope that like smoking and drink driving the social norm will change and we listen, trust and believe the victim when they report it.
> I hope no one on this chat has experience rape.
G has, and has written about it:
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@neil @girlonthenet I thought that Masto was the least likely ‘group chat’ for this problem? I’m definitely NOT in any other group chats where this might come up. I support your efforts, but if you’re likely to speak up then you are very unlikely to be in those groups in the first place.
@theolodian @neil it's always embarrassing when people reply to a blog post having only read the first few paragraphs, but with this one in particular... oh boy. It must be absolutely *excruciating* for you.
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@neil @girlonthenet It's weird that US universities have their own police...
@rubinjoni @neil Isn't it? Like... what in the world?
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@WhiteCatTamer @varx @neil yes! Very very good points.
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@varx @girlonthenet this may or may not be the case so only take on board if needed, but
As a man
You need to build trust with women in your friendship circle for them to feel comfortable opening up. That's not a them problem. Men traumatise us throughout our lives so generally yes, we're going to be cagier around men.If you prove you're a safe person - doesn't have to be consciously, just be one. Be kind, not one of the Lads, not thinking to yourself whether she'll bang you if you are just nice enough... And friendship naturally becomes more open.
None of us is owed other people's confidence. We have to work at being safe enough to receive it.
@noodlemaz @varx omg yes absolutely and completely this. Working on being a safe person - the kind of person people feel comfortable sharing these things with - is also a valuable part of dismantling the culture. And it's not easy, but it's vital to do. Thanks NM!
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@theolodian @neil it's always embarrassing when people reply to a blog post having only read the first few paragraphs, but with this one in particular... oh boy. It must be absolutely *excruciating* for you.
@girlonthenet @neil apologies, I’ll run AI over it first next time.
Muted
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@girlonthenet @neil @brunogirin a 502 is a "bad gateway", which basically means that a request went through, but there was nothing around to receive it. In cases like this, it's typically because the server is busy serving others.
I don't know your hosting situation, but whomever you use, they likely have some way to scale up available resources. It might be a good idea to bump the number of available servers around new release times, or see if they support autoscaling.
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You know what we see a lot of? Women writing posts like this.
You know what we DON'T see *any* of?? Men writing blog posts about how they had the awkward conversation with a friend group, shut down a team mate's behaviour, or called out a colleague's sexist joke... and how awkward & uncomfortable & important & *worthwhile* that was.
Men need to normalize this. Start by doing it, then talk about it. Then never shut up about it.
@syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet top take away for me, the CIS white male, was to say things like "that university frat thing, huh, terrible" out loud more
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@girlonthenet yes, love this; reiterating that it's always optional.
@varx There was a definite moment when my female friends started to open up to me about male violence, well before I transitioned. If I had to guess it was because I'd learned to Just Listen, not attempt to posture or problem-solve or analyse.
And what I saw (with some pride) was that I had shifted in my friends' eyes into first and foremost their friend. A friend they trusted and could be honest with. Not a man they had to be guarded around. And I knew that trust came with a responsibility to do the work of both friendship and allyship.
I feel that if a woman trusts you enough to tell you that she has been raped, she has already judged you as someone trustworthy, regardless of your gender. I say believe in that trust, and believe that you can be worthy of it.
@neil -
Men, *please* go and read this blogpost by @girlonthenet:
https://www.girlonthenet.com/blog/cornell/
It discusses rape, rape culture and the recent news about Cornell University and, as usual, G lands her points clearly and compellingly. One. After. Another.
@neil yes! I wrote my own thread myself, but this from @girlonthenet is so on point:
Protecting women from rape doesn’t mean swooping in like Superman to wild applause and a sense of victory, it means starting a conversation that might leave you feeling like shit.
It's a horrible, gut-wrenching feeling of being That Guy. The one who "can't take a joke", or is "causing drama" or "white knighting". Who will likely be excluded from guys' conversions or nights out, who risks losing promotion prospects or friendships. For what reward? Often just the reassurance of one's own moral compass.
It's the right thing nonetheless.
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Men, *please* go and read this blogpost by @girlonthenet:
https://www.girlonthenet.com/blog/cornell/
It discusses rape, rape culture and the recent news about Cornell University and, as usual, G lands her points clearly and compellingly. One. After. Another.
Read her post about rape, and that we, as men, should be doing more. A lot more.
And read her linked post about Pelico. It was so much worse than anything I've read until now.
And then ask yourself, as I am,
"What more can I do?"
And DO IT.
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Men, *please* go and read this blogpost by @girlonthenet:
https://www.girlonthenet.com/blog/cornell/
It discusses rape, rape culture and the recent news about Cornell University and, as usual, G lands her points clearly and compellingly. One. After. Another.
@neil @girlonthenet
> Saying ‘I don’t want to hang out with that man because he repeatedly makes jokes about sexual assault/treats women like they’re livestock/touches women without their consent’ is hard.why do we accept #animals being treated as #livestock? there are men who earn their living by touching #female animals without their consent. rape euphemized as "artificial insemination". we need to challenge this rape culture in every form, which includes calling out those who sell, buy or consume #breastmilk — so-called #dairy — taken without consent.
humans-only feminism makes about as much sense as whites-only feminism. #veganism is #feminism.
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You know what we see a lot of? Women writing posts like this.
You know what we DON'T see *any* of?? Men writing blog posts about how they had the awkward conversation with a friend group, shut down a team mate's behaviour, or called out a colleague's sexist joke... and how awkward & uncomfortable & important & *worthwhile* that was.
Men need to normalize this. Start by doing it, then talk about it. Then never shut up about it.
@syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet@mastodon.social
I do hear men saying that sort of thing in 'men groups' - maybe not enough, but I don't quite see why it would come up in the sort of conversation my peer group* would have.*Retired people, mostly. Mainly men at my petanque club; mainly women at the Tai Chi class; equal mix at our allotment. Central England.
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You know what we see a lot of? Women writing posts like this.
You know what we DON'T see *any* of?? Men writing blog posts about how they had the awkward conversation with a friend group, shut down a team mate's behaviour, or called out a colleague's sexist joke... and how awkward & uncomfortable & important & *worthwhile* that was.
Men need to normalize this. Start by doing it, then talk about it. Then never shut up about it.
@syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet Yep that’s a good point. I guess it’s good to share such situations, even if it’s just just for visibility.
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@neil @girlonthenet
> Saying ‘I don’t want to hang out with that man because he repeatedly makes jokes about sexual assault/treats women like they’re livestock/touches women without their consent’ is hard.why do we accept #animals being treated as #livestock? there are men who earn their living by touching #female animals without their consent. rape euphemized as "artificial insemination". we need to challenge this rape culture in every form, which includes calling out those who sell, buy or consume #breastmilk — so-called #dairy — taken without consent.
humans-only feminism makes about as much sense as whites-only feminism. #veganism is #feminism.
@pelle @neil @girlonthenet look I'm a vegan too but what you're doing here is like commenting on someone's post about bowel cancer to say "breast cancer is terrible too, why aren't you talking about all cancer?" This is a post about the Cornell rape case and how men prefer to talk about this sort of thing to women where it will get them credit than to other men where it will be awkward and uncomfortable but has a chance of actual helping with something. If you want to read a post about the treatment of female livestock write your own instead of criticising a woman for not writing exactly what you wanted to read.
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J jwcph@helvede.net shared this topic
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@syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet top take away for me, the CIS white male, was to say things like "that university frat thing, huh, terrible" out loud more
@falken @syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet
I say "What are their _other_ crimes?"
There will be some.
Probably.
And they may be easier targets.
This is not a post about a #president -
@syntaxseed @neil @girlonthenet@mastodon.social
I do hear men saying that sort of thing in 'men groups' - maybe not enough, but I don't quite see why it would come up in the sort of conversation my peer group* would have.*Retired people, mostly. Mainly men at my petanque club; mainly women at the Tai Chi class; equal mix at our allotment. Central England.
@MikeFromLFE @syntaxseed@phpc.social @neil bring it up
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@syntaxseed@phpc.social @neil @girlonthenet so much this.
dudes should be great at the never shutting up about it part!
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@pelle @neil @girlonthenet look I'm a vegan too but what you're doing here is like commenting on someone's post about bowel cancer to say "breast cancer is terrible too, why aren't you talking about all cancer?" This is a post about the Cornell rape case and how men prefer to talk about this sort of thing to women where it will get them credit than to other men where it will be awkward and uncomfortable but has a chance of actual helping with something. If you want to read a post about the treatment of female livestock write your own instead of criticising a woman for not writing exactly what you wanted to read.
@afewbugs
you can do a post against rape without using degrading slurs ( #livestock — like they are just a product with a pulse) against others that legitimize them being raped.the post does mention a horrible rape case and also condemns rape culture in general so i don't see how it's off-topic to mention this normalized rape culture that @girlonthenet even mentions but unfortunately helps to normalize.
like a feminism that excludes black women is racist, a feminism that excludes cows is speciecist. being #vegan doesn't make you immune from #speciecism.
@neil -
@afewbugs
you can do a post against rape without using degrading slurs ( #livestock — like they are just a product with a pulse) against others that legitimize them being raped.the post does mention a horrible rape case and also condemns rape culture in general so i don't see how it's off-topic to mention this normalized rape culture that @girlonthenet even mentions but unfortunately helps to normalize.
like a feminism that excludes black women is racist, a feminism that excludes cows is speciecist. being #vegan doesn't make you immune from #speciecism.
@neil@pelle if your takeaway from this post is the most important action required from you as a man is to criticise the author's choice of language you are 100% part of the problem here.
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P pelle@veganism.social shared this topic
