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  3. For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

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debianllmfoss
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  • josch@floss.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
    josch@floss.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
    josch@floss.social
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #1

    For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

    And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

    https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

    olasd@mastodon.opportunis.meO soapdog@social.soapdog.orgS bremner@mathstodon.xyzB malte@anticapitalist.partyM paelnever@masto.esP 10 Replies Last reply
    0
    • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

      For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

      And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

      https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

      olasd@mastodon.opportunis.meO This user is from outside of this forum
      olasd@mastodon.opportunis.meO This user is from outside of this forum
      olasd@mastodon.opportunis.me
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #2

      @josch thank you for your message, and "AOL", as the kids would say.

      S 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • olasd@mastodon.opportunis.meO olasd@mastodon.opportunis.me

        @josch thank you for your message, and "AOL", as the kids would say.

        S This user is from outside of this forum
        S This user is from outside of this forum
        spanezz@mastodon.bida.im
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #3

        @olasd @josch likewise. I'm about to orphan everything I still maintain in Debian that I don't *have* to maintain because of some work commitment

        debacle@framapiaf.orgD josch@floss.socialJ 2 Replies Last reply
        0
        • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

          For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

          And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

          https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

          soapdog@social.soapdog.orgS This user is from outside of this forum
          soapdog@social.soapdog.orgS This user is from outside of this forum
          soapdog@social.soapdog.org
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #4

          @josch I am so sorry Debian is going this route and that you found yourself in such position. That sucks. Hope your time outside is great (it is raining a lot here so it is time for coding with rain sounds for me)

          josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

            For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

            And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

            https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

            bremner@mathstodon.xyzB This user is from outside of this forum
            bremner@mathstodon.xyzB This user is from outside of this forum
            bremner@mathstodon.xyz
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #5

            @josch Thanks, you hit all the points I wanted to mention.

            josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • S spanezz@mastodon.bida.im

              @olasd @josch likewise. I'm about to orphan everything I still maintain in Debian that I don't *have* to maintain because of some work commitment

              debacle@framapiaf.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
              debacle@framapiaf.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
              debacle@framapiaf.org
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #6

              @spanezz @olasd @josch

              I will continue uploading to #Debian NEW, but I will most likely not read any reaction to an upload, that has been written solely by an #LLM.

              I love the Debian project for #human interactions. Let's keep Debian human or at least nice among #primates, naked or hairy.

              While I'm personally very critical about use of LLMs, I do accept, if people use it to e.g. polish their english or similar things. But don't throw unfiltered AI output at primates. We deserve better 🙂

              gisgeek@floss.socialG josch@floss.socialJ 2 Replies Last reply
              0
              • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                malte@anticapitalist.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
                malte@anticapitalist.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
                malte@anticapitalist.party
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #7

                @josch

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                  For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                  And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                  https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                  paelnever@masto.esP This user is from outside of this forum
                  paelnever@masto.esP This user is from outside of this forum
                  paelnever@masto.es
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #8

                  @josch
                  No worries, i saw the same criticism and people screaming they are leaving for using coding tools that highlight code syntax, FOSS life keeps going on without you.

                  woo@fosstodon.orgW 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                    For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                    And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                    https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                    rick@a.n0id.spaceR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rick@a.n0id.spaceR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rick@a.n0id.space
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #9
                    @josch urgh i hate this tl...
                    sending virtual hugs
                    josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • debacle@framapiaf.orgD debacle@framapiaf.org

                      @spanezz @olasd @josch

                      I will continue uploading to #Debian NEW, but I will most likely not read any reaction to an upload, that has been written solely by an #LLM.

                      I love the Debian project for #human interactions. Let's keep Debian human or at least nice among #primates, naked or hairy.

                      While I'm personally very critical about use of LLMs, I do accept, if people use it to e.g. polish their english or similar things. But don't throw unfiltered AI output at primates. We deserve better 🙂

                      gisgeek@floss.socialG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gisgeek@floss.socialG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gisgeek@floss.social
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #10

                      @debacle @spanezz @olasd @josch

                      I find pretending to answer to an upload in NEW queue solely by LLM unattended tooling is something to discuss, not automatically adopt.

                      It is a tool, as for lintian, not a team decision. As such, it should help the team, with a suitable review. Possibly, also the maintainer, but in both cases it cannot be considered an obligation.

                      atax1a@infosec.exchangeA 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                        For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                        And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                        https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                        giacomo@snac.tesio.itG This user is from outside of this forum
                        giacomo@snac.tesio.itG This user is from outside of this forum
                        giacomo@snac.tesio.it
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #11
                        @josch@floss.social

                        I'm afraid the capture of #Debian will pass through similar insulting behaviours (such pushing LLM output on people who refuse it) that will alienate all politically aware developers.

                        It's sad, but likely the goal of those who made this move.

                        Maybe you might find some joy working on #NetBSD or even on #9front.

                        Good luck!

                        And thanks for fighting this fight.
                        josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                          For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                          And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                          https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                          mildpeach@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                          mildpeach@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                          mildpeach@mstdn.social
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #12

                          @josch @Lamuchan As a debian user this is quite disturbing.

                          boud@framapiaf.orgB 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • gisgeek@floss.socialG gisgeek@floss.social

                            @debacle @spanezz @olasd @josch

                            I find pretending to answer to an upload in NEW queue solely by LLM unattended tooling is something to discuss, not automatically adopt.

                            It is a tool, as for lintian, not a team decision. As such, it should help the team, with a suitable review. Possibly, also the maintainer, but in both cases it cannot be considered an obligation.

                            atax1a@infosec.exchangeA This user is from outside of this forum
                            atax1a@infosec.exchangeA This user is from outside of this forum
                            atax1a@infosec.exchange
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #13

                            @gisgeek it is a tool designed by technocratic fascists that is also completely unfit for any purpose and causes massive amounts of externalized harms. it should not be used at all.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • mildpeach@mstdn.socialM mildpeach@mstdn.social

                              @josch @Lamuchan As a debian user this is quite disturbing.

                              boud@framapiaf.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                              boud@framapiaf.orgB This user is from outside of this forum
                              boud@framapiaf.org
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #14

                              @mildpeach @josch @Lamuchan

                              In the ongoing discussion [1], it looks like there's rough consensus to make the LLM NEW-queue reviews at least opt-out, and preferably opt-in. It's bad that someone thought that they could impose this without getting any objections, but it looks like there are plenty of objections (only one consequentalist claim - "but it works" - that I can see).

                              [1] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/threads.html#00263

                              josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                                For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                                And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                                https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                                k0pernicus@mastodon.gamedev.placeK This user is from outside of this forum
                                k0pernicus@mastodon.gamedev.placeK This user is from outside of this forum
                                k0pernicus@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #15

                                @josch amen. Touching grass is the best thing we can do, us, careful people.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • josch@floss.socialJ josch@floss.social

                                  For now, I will no longer be uploading to the #Debian NEW queue.

                                  And yes, I will now go outside and do something nice instead of trying to argue on mailing lists about #LLM use in #FOSS. Maybe do the same. The weather is great outside. 🙂

                                  https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2026/10/msg00263.html

                                  aks@social.akselmo.devA This user is from outside of this forum
                                  aks@social.akselmo.devA This user is from outside of this forum
                                  aks@social.akselmo.dev
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #16

                                  @josch sorry you have to deal with this nonsense

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • paelnever@masto.esP paelnever@masto.es

                                    @josch
                                    No worries, i saw the same criticism and people screaming they are leaving for using coding tools that highlight code syntax, FOSS life keeps going on without you.

                                    woo@fosstodon.orgW This user is from outside of this forum
                                    woo@fosstodon.orgW This user is from outside of this forum
                                    woo@fosstodon.org
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #17

                                    @paelnever @josch Did you though? I've never seen a FOSS development that forced a particular tool on coders. Those tools didn't destroy the environment.

                                    paelnever@masto.esP 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • woo@fosstodon.orgW woo@fosstodon.org

                                      @paelnever @josch Did you though? I've never seen a FOSS development that forced a particular tool on coders. Those tools didn't destroy the environment.

                                      paelnever@masto.esP This user is from outside of this forum
                                      paelnever@masto.esP This user is from outside of this forum
                                      paelnever@masto.es
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #18

                                      @woo @josch
                                      Just 2 wrong things in your argument.
                                      1) Read again, Debian is not forcing ANYBODY to use LLMs
                                      2) You are forced to use internet and computers to write and submit code and i don't see you screaming for that.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • woo@fosstodon.orgW This user is from outside of this forum
                                        woo@fosstodon.orgW This user is from outside of this forum
                                        woo@fosstodon.org
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #19

                                        @TFF @josch Another AI 'benefit'. It should be even warmer next year when AI does its work for #ClimateChaos

                                        josch@floss.socialJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • S spanezz@mastodon.bida.im

                                          @olasd @josch likewise. I'm about to orphan everything I still maintain in Debian that I don't *have* to maintain because of some work commitment

                                          josch@floss.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                          josch@floss.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                          josch@floss.social
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #20

                                          @spanezz I started moving some of my packages into the "Debian Commons" team for similar reasons. They can use their tokens to maintain these packages for all I care. Rest assured I'll keep following your account here last but not least to learn where you (and others) might move your FOSS involvement to. Debian is its people and if the people I like are elsewhere, then we will just work together on free software elsewhere. 🙂 @olasd

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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