Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels.
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon NdGT lays out the problem.
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon people will say anything for oil money.
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@jon What I always feel gets missed out on the subject of bird deaths is: nothing has a bigger overall, long-term impact on bird populations than habitat loss.
And what makes habitat loss a much, much more pressing concern? Climate change.
Over a longer period, turbines can save the lives of countless birds.
@RolloTreadway @jon just wait til people find out about the wildlife destruction caused by cars...
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“And those turbines you see in Brandenburg approaching Berlin are so UGLY!” he went on. Climate change, that’s ugly. #StateOfEU
@jon Living in Czech Republic I don't cease to be amazed by how brainwashed against wind turbines the people are here. Even biologists working with Ecology support this nonsense. Both this "ugly/changes the landscape" stuff, and the birds. What is worse is that here they're all in on nuclear, believe it's all they'll ever need. I think there is a point to be made that disabling already installed nuclear was a bad move in Germany, but building new will never be worth it compared to alternatives.
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This is the ethical point here: NOTHING is more important than combatting climate change. Nothing. Without a liveable planet nothing else works. I’ll have a debate about the numbers, and how to decarbonise. But I’ve no time for whataboutism, nimbyism or conspiracy theories. #StateOfEU
@jon That's a statement of personal values that is not universal. There are things more important than personal survival and there are things more important than cultural or even species survival. -
Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon Let me guess: Cherry picked examples of their "dangers" and for each of these scenarios they're not even in the top 50 of worst offenders.
- Dead birds? Guess we should ban outdoor cats.
- Microplastics? Let me tell you a story about tire and brake abrasions.
- Infrasound emissions? Again, have you heard about cars, heavy industry or data centers?!
- Space requirements? Again... Cars? -
“And those turbines you see in Brandenburg approaching Berlin are so UGLY!” he went on. Climate change, that’s ugly. #StateOfEU
@jon the turbines I see in Brandenburg when I come back to Berlin are awesome! That person is an idiot
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon That conspiracy theory was probably an American export...apologies
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon My analysis would suggest that trying to stuff all this cheap renewable wind power onto a JIT grid is a poor climate optimization strategy. All the wind datasets I’ve modelled exhibit unbridgeable seasonal supply deficits. There is a better way. Use wind to make green steel.
https://energyasicit.ca/EnergyVision/
https://energyasicit.ca/HomeEnergy/ -
And there was another line. “It’s rich landowners in Brandenburg taking the subsidies from the state to build wind turbines”. This is an equality / distribution issue, not an energy issue! Think of the opposite: “we shouldn’t build turbines there because the land owners are rich!” Errrr… #StateOfEU
@jon Also we know since the 1980s that the solution is to #tax rents/windfall profits. Not perfect, but better than other solutions.
Or in other words, «From an allocative efficiency perspective, the proposed cap is not strategically neutral to market participants, but clearly superior to alternative measures that affect price formation overall, such as subsidies to marginal technologies or the abandonment of uniform pricing.»
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/thinktank/en/document/IPOL_STU(2023)740076 -
@nikolar Right. Exactly this. It’s so obviously stupid as an argument but here I am with university educated polite society and I’m confronted with it. As if it’s an acceptable argument!
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Just had to deal with a bunch of wind turbine conspiracy theories at #StateOfEU, this polite political event I’m at in Brussels. Damn we‘re fucked. Fucked. Our notional political elite is believing in utter complete garbage.
@jon I assumed as much after following #ChatControl poop-show.
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Yep, but that's the thing: many people, politicians and citizens alike, disagree with you on that point! That's democracy for you.
@jackofalltrades something that’s wrong is wrong, however many people believe it
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@econads@mendeddrum.org @jon@gruene.social who cares whether it's renewable? Biogas is technically renewable even though it is a fossil fuel. We need to focus entirely on carbon sequestration and environmental impact, not a meaningless buzzword.
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@jon respectfully, if we somehow resolve/address our climate change problem, but not our #racism problem, that's a fail. BOTH are peer priorities a la #ClimateJustice.
@greg_b Sure. But fighting for our future in an unliveable world isn’t going to help people be respectful to their neighbours.
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This is the ethical point here: NOTHING is more important than combatting climate change. Nothing. Without a liveable planet nothing else works. I’ll have a debate about the numbers, and how to decarbonise. But I’ve no time for whataboutism, nimbyism or conspiracy theories. #StateOfEU
@jon We're all going to die anyways.
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@jon people will say anything for oil money.
@crucialbreeze he’s not even directly paid by them! (The one I was talking to)
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@jon Living in Czech Republic I don't cease to be amazed by how brainwashed against wind turbines the people are here. Even biologists working with Ecology support this nonsense. Both this "ugly/changes the landscape" stuff, and the birds. What is worse is that here they're all in on nuclear, believe it's all they'll ever need. I think there is a point to be made that disabling already installed nuclear was a bad move in Germany, but building new will never be worth it compared to alternatives.
@LeoRJorge Right
that re Germany. -
@jon That's a statement of personal values that is not universal. There are things more important than personal survival and there are things more important than cultural or even species survival.
@mike this isn’t personal survival. It’s species survival. I’ll survive personally.
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@jon the turbines I see in Brandenburg when I come back to Berlin are awesome! That person is an idiot
@matzipan Same! Totally.
