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  3. I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter.

I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter.

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  • pikesley@mastodon.me.ukP pikesley@mastodon.me.uk

    @graham_arden @tante

    Not the way *he* uses it though, he knows what he's doing

    europlus@social.europlus.zoneE This user is from outside of this forum
    europlus@social.europlus.zoneE This user is from outside of this forum
    europlus@social.europlus.zone
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #33

    @pikesley @graham_arden @tante that’s because he’s good at nuancing*.

    *A new word I learnt this week from an AI apologist right here on Madtodon

    1 Reply Last reply
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    • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

      RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

      I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

      My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

      benjaoming@social.data.coopB This user is from outside of this forum
      benjaoming@social.data.coopB This user is from outside of this forum
      benjaoming@social.data.coop
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #34

      @tante Anthropic etc. can implement regulations as terribly as they like and people will get very angry at the EU. "Malicious compliance" comes to mind.

      1 Reply Last reply
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      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

        RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

        I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

        My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

        europlus@social.europlus.zoneE This user is from outside of this forum
        europlus@social.europlus.zoneE This user is from outside of this forum
        europlus@social.europlus.zone
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #35

        @tante @daringfireball oh dog, it’s sooo looooong, I almost caved and got an AI to summarise it for me!

        naturemc@mastodon.onlineN 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

          RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

          I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

          My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

          skington@glasgow.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
          skington@glasgow.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
          skington@glasgow.social
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #36

          @tante @daringfireball The problem with dismissing this as “nanny state, pipe-dream nonsense”, like Gruber does with basically everything coming from the EU these days, is that he fails to engage with *why* the EU is doing this. If the EU wants it to be reasonably obvious that any content was AI-generated, it’s because they think there otherwise would be too much AI. Ergo, making AI-generated text worse is exactly what the policy demands!

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

            RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

            I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

            My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

            naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
            naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
            naturemc@mastodon.online
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #37

            @tante 🎯
            Reading texts is part of my profession.

            As I tried to read that extreme tl;dr I asked myself, if my brain had lost too many synapses by the heatwave.

            If the future are such texts, 🥶 I want to retire straight away!

            bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

              RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

              I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

              My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

              pablobm@metalhead.clubP This user is from outside of this forum
              pablobm@metalhead.clubP This user is from outside of this forum
              pablobm@metalhead.club
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #38

              @tante I'm particularly bewildered at the part about proofreading: so how do people use this stuff for proofreading exactly? Does Gruber accept el Claudillo's decree's^Wedits willy-nilly? "Oh the parrot likes this word better, I guess I'll use it then". Well, then you do deserve being flagged as AI-generated!

              db@magrathea.spaceD ben@mastodon.bentasker.co.ukB 2 Replies Last reply
              0
              • annika@xoxo.zoneA annika@xoxo.zone

                @tante "The idea that anything other than *my* needs should factor into the generation of text for *me* is patently offensive."

                That's the most direct "I don't care about externalities" I've read in a while.

                bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB This user is from outside of this forum
                bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB This user is from outside of this forum
                bms@mastodon.bsd.cafe
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #39

                @annika @tante This attitude is more prevalent than one might think, and it extends into the domain of even those who, one might think, should know better.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • naturemc@mastodon.onlineN naturemc@mastodon.online

                  @tante 🎯
                  Reading texts is part of my profession.

                  As I tried to read that extreme tl;dr I asked myself, if my brain had lost too many synapses by the heatwave.

                  If the future are such texts, 🥶 I want to retire straight away!

                  bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB This user is from outside of this forum
                  bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB This user is from outside of this forum
                  bms@mastodon.bsd.cafe
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #40

                  @NatureMC @tante thank you Petra for reminding me of my massive IETF RFC "to review" queue. 😞

                  naturemc@mastodon.onlineN 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • europlus@social.europlus.zoneE europlus@social.europlus.zone

                    @tante @daringfireball oh dog, it’s sooo looooong, I almost caved and got an AI to summarise it for me!

                    naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
                    naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
                    naturemc@mastodon.online
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #41

                    @europlus 🤣 @tante @daringfireball

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • bms@mastodon.bsd.cafeB bms@mastodon.bsd.cafe

                      @NatureMC @tante thank you Petra for reminding me of my massive IETF RFC "to review" queue. 😞

                      naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
                      naturemc@mastodon.onlineN This user is from outside of this forum
                      naturemc@mastodon.online
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #42

                      @bms My condolences. 😎 @tante

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • frog_reborn@mstdn.socialF frog_reborn@mstdn.social

                        @tante

                        His brain is truly cooked

                        "LLMs are, in their popular incarnations, non-deterministic. Ask the same question of the same model and you often get at least slightly different answers. Maybe the same meaning, but different phrasing"

                        "One of my fundamental problems with [watermarking] is that no two synonyms carry the exact same meaning. “He leaped at the chance” and “He jumped at the opportunity” are very similar sentences expressing the same general sentiment, but they are not the same

                        greg@icosahedron.websiteG This user is from outside of this forum
                        greg@icosahedron.websiteG This user is from outside of this forum
                        greg@icosahedron.website
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #43

                        @frog_reborn @tante lmaooo. words only mean things sometimes, when it's convenient for my argument

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • G gerardthornley@hachyderm.io

                          @tymwol @danielaKay @tante Was going to say this also — patterns are likely to transfer from llm to natural writing as people get exposed to the former.

                          patrys@mastodon.onlineP This user is from outside of this forum
                          patrys@mastodon.onlineP This user is from outside of this forum
                          patrys@mastodon.online
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #44

                          @GerardThornley @tymwol @danielaKay @tante

                          The watermarking is about *how* you choose the next token, not *which* word that ends up being. So the patterns are not something you can recognize or subconsciously learn and repeat.

                          For a gross oversimplification, imagine you always choose the second most likely candidate exactly eight times in a row, followed by selecting the fourth candidate exactly once, followed by exactly five more second candidates.

                          1 Reply Last reply
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                          • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                            RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

                            I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

                            My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

                            vorsos@beige.partyV This user is from outside of this forum
                            vorsos@beige.partyV This user is from outside of this forum
                            vorsos@beige.party
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #45

                            @tante Yes, the genocide fan who denies trans voices and looks down on most of humanity is also a botlicker.

                            Anyone non-critically linking to independent Fox News dipshit John Gruber is dangerous.

                            https://beige.party/@Vorsos/115499360647025445

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                              RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

                              I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

                              My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

                              unchartedworlds@scicomm.xyzU This user is from outside of this forum
                              unchartedworlds@scicomm.xyzU This user is from outside of this forum
                              unchartedworlds@scicomm.xyz
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #46

                              @tante

                              Yes, silly to claim outrage about a non-deterministic thing being non-deterministic in a very slightly different way. It's a bit like giving an output in millimetres to a sum where one of the inputs was "about a mile".

                              But I feel I must give the writer credit for the phrase "the saccharine Claude personality stink"!

                              #LLMs

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • pablobm@metalhead.clubP pablobm@metalhead.club

                                @tante I'm particularly bewildered at the part about proofreading: so how do people use this stuff for proofreading exactly? Does Gruber accept el Claudillo's decree's^Wedits willy-nilly? "Oh the parrot likes this word better, I guess I'll use it then". Well, then you do deserve being flagged as AI-generated!

                                db@magrathea.spaceD This user is from outside of this forum
                                db@magrathea.spaceD This user is from outside of this forum
                                db@magrathea.space
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #47
                                @pablobm @tante It’s baffling to me that someone who makes a living from his writing is taking this stance.
                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • pablobm@metalhead.clubP pablobm@metalhead.club

                                  @tante I'm particularly bewildered at the part about proofreading: so how do people use this stuff for proofreading exactly? Does Gruber accept el Claudillo's decree's^Wedits willy-nilly? "Oh the parrot likes this word better, I guess I'll use it then". Well, then you do deserve being flagged as AI-generated!

                                  ben@mastodon.bentasker.co.ukB This user is from outside of this forum
                                  ben@mastodon.bentasker.co.ukB This user is from outside of this forum
                                  ben@mastodon.bentasker.co.uk
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #48

                                  @pablobm @tante I made it to here before rolling my eyes

                                  > serves to show just how little regard the people behind these generated-text fingerprinting schemes have for the actual craft of writing

                                  I'm not sure it counts as a craft if you outsource it all to a machine

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                    RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

                                    I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

                                    My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

                                    munin@mastoart.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    munin@mastoart.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    munin@mastoart.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #49

                                    @tante Also, you want the "best" word? What an unsolvable philosophical predicament to put onto a computer. Saying such things makes it obvious that they do not care about writing, language, or intent.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • krnlg@mastodon.socialK krnlg@mastodon.social

                                      @tante
                                      To me it's also like, not everything has to be perfectly optimised. How you write *doesn't* have to be perfect. How you live life doesn't have to be optimised.

                                      caracabe@mastoart.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                      caracabe@mastoart.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                      caracabe@mastoart.social
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #50

                                      @krnlg @tante As I like to say, “Be 80% of all you can be. Over-optimized systems are fragile.”

                                      billseitz@mastodon.socialB 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                        RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

                                        I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

                                        My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

                                        ferrix@mastodon.onlineF This user is from outside of this forum
                                        ferrix@mastodon.onlineF This user is from outside of this forum
                                        ferrix@mastodon.online
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #51

                                        @tante a perversion of writing? By the perversion of writing machine?

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                          RE: https://mastodon.social/@daringfireball/117106850045916140

                                          I love how this waxes poetically how "The exact words we choose when writing matter. I want any LLM I use to choose the very best, most precise words at every single decision point."

                                          My brother in christ: Then you shouldn't be using a stochastic text extruder.

                                          lrhodes@merveilles.townL This user is from outside of this forum
                                          lrhodes@merveilles.townL This user is from outside of this forum
                                          lrhodes@merveilles.town
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #52

                                          @tante I totally identify with the sentiment. When I write, I want to result to reflect my intended meaning as faithfully as possible. I just don't get how you ever expect that from a LLM, even before it starts using acrostic poetry to thread its own copyright through what is ostensibly your writing.

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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