If you're a white person on the Fediverse and you've never seen someone called a slur, or threats made against them--congratulations!
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@dave doing the woooooooooork
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@MxAlba @dave No, it doesn't work like that.
If their instance was breaking the reply restrictions rule, your instance would detect that when they try to federate the reply to your instance, and would reject it. Then you would not see it, and it also would not get federated to anyone who opens your post looking for the replies.
Your instance could also use detection of this behavior to automatically place the offending instance on limited federation and add it to a review queue of abusive instances that are candidates for defederation.
@dalias@hachyderm.io @dave@alvarado.social
Thanks for the education! So it does sound like that might be a solution... -
@dave this is actually super helpful for me, Dave. makes it super clear. I knew it was happening, never understood how, or why I couldn't see it.
Thank you!
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> 5. Everybody says "I don't see it so it's not happening."
I would never say that. I think multiple times I've said "I don't see it but of course I believe you, what can we do?"
So what can we do?
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@dave Would it be possible to add a way to ban "followers only replies"? As a toggle in user preferences, or something, anyone know?
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If you're a white person on the Fediverse and you've never seen someone called a slur, or threats made against them--congratulations! You don't follow any dirtbags. But, it's happening every day and it's being hidden from you.
@dave Sorry to hear this. Do block people you don't like, seek out ones you do. You have to work to make Mastodon the place you want it to be. Sorry that you have to work harder than white people; if I could change that, I would.
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@Crissa @dave I limit reply visibility to followers only or mentioned only a lot when it's something that I don't want to show up on random stranger's timelines. Sometimes it's to reduce the amount of replyguys. Sometimes it's sorta personal stuff (not to the level of "move to Signal" but still not the sort of thing everyone needs to read)
@JessTheUnstill @Crissa @dave I do it for call-ins. There are a lot of marginalized people in my circles, but we all make mistakes and every once in a while let slip an unexamined bias. So when one of my peers says something harmful, I'm likely to call them on it in a followers only post, because I don't want to leave it unaddressed but also really don't want to cause a dogpile. So it's a tool that's used both for preventing harassment and for harassment
I'm not sure how to resolve that -
@dalias@hachyderm.io @dave@alvarado.social
Thanks for the education! So it does sound like that might be a solution... -
@dave couldn't the post be signed including the security options? Then editing them would cause a bad sig and get it dropped?
@stuartyeates @dave It could, but that would be a whole new protocol. ActivityPubS
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@dave Thanks for sharing your moderation advice.
I wonder if point 3/4 is occurring on other platforms due to the algorithms masking it.
e.g. You've previously expressed an interest in piling on to harras people, here's more opportunities for you to do that...
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@dave I don't think sharing receipts is super necessary. It just smears the shit, so to speak.
And like, I've gotten this kind of harassment. usually on my pinned wedding photo because if one of my posts gets shared into an asshole instance, all the pinned posts come with it.
I report it to my admin, and she mashes the block/defederate button and takes care of it.
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@dave @skinnylatte that explains a lot
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@dave
I appreciate the explanation of the problem. It's quite enlightening. Is there anything actionable I can do as non-moderator that happens to be on the Fediverse? Presumably raising awareness helps, but is there anything else I should be doing?@chocobo13 You can explain it to those who still thinks it's not happening.
Harassers also sometimes target hashtags or groups, so you could watch those (e.g. #MutualAid or #BlackMastodon and definitely #FediBlock) and help by reporting anything you might see there.
Also, read https://infosec.exchange/@thenexusofprivacy/112956213079993182
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@dave Would it be possible to add a way to ban "followers only replies"? As a toggle in user preferences, or something, anyone know?
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@dave Would it be possible to add a way to ban "followers only replies"? As a toggle in user preferences, or something, anyone know?
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@dave Among the other reply controls, I want an option where I can set it so nobody can reply to me with "followers-only" post privacy. That would cut off this vector entirely, and help with a lot of other bad UX.
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@shlee @dave @StingrayBadger
That would make a lot of sense, don't know who's in a position to work towards making it happen. -
@dave Is there a shit mastodon says account yet? Maybe people could anonymously shame the harassers by messaging screenshots and posting them that way.
@semitones @dave the harassers know where the Screenshots come from. They were part of the "interaction".
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@dave bonus points when the victim is blocked and not able to report report said harrassment…
- They can even prevent admins from seeing the posts in question
- This is a serious issue that #Mastodon #developers refuse to address, alongside the unwillingness to address basic features that every other internet-facing application has, like blocklist feed support…
- They can even prevent admins from seeing the posts in question
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@dave I don't know if this would be feasible, but I really really think that "followers only" should not mean "the followers of the account posting" but "the followers of the account posting and those of all accounts named in the post".
Even leaving aside the serious issue of harassment, it would make totally friendly and civil threads that hang off a followers-only top post, into a conversation one's followers could take part in without also following everyone who comments.
@dragonfrog @dave
How about "followers of the author of the original post that started the thread"? "Followers of anyone mentioned" is going to take a lot of queries to different servers to get the list of followers - and some instances may not even make the list available for privacy reasons. Followers of the OP could be done by having such replies go through the OPs instance.Having followers only replies gobthrough the OPs instance would be more eork for the developers, but the current solution is useless for replies, because two people with distinct sets of followers having a followers only discussion are going to sound like listening to one half of a phone conversation.
