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  3. A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

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  • lerxst@az.socialL lerxst@az.social

    @sarajw @mhoye I'm old enough to remember when I got into this field when there were more women in it. Back then, it was a way to make a decent living, but not a path to riches.

    That changed with the internet boom and I ran into fewer women developers and sysadmins. Once it got out of its "clerical" status and into a path to riches, the demographics shifted. My first dev job iin 1990 was 40% women devs to 60%.

    I've worked in places since then with NO women devs. Those all sucked, BTW.

    sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
    sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
    sarajw@front-end.social
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #19

    @lerxst @mhoye mmhmmm. Amazing how the women got pushed out, I guess because it was seen as something that the clever men should do and be well paid for...

    sarajw@front-end.socialS eons@mastodon.gamedev.placeE 2 Replies Last reply
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    • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

      @lerxst @mhoye mmhmmm. Amazing how the women got pushed out, I guess because it was seen as something that the clever men should do and be well paid for...

      sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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      sarajw@front-end.social
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #20

      @lerxst @mhoye the way I see it, it *should* be an ideal job for a parent (whether male, female, NB), with good opportunities to work async, part time, from home.

      Sadly structural stuff, mandatory meetings, the so many "ritual" meetings make the async part-timeness more difficult.

      lerxst@az.socialL 1 Reply Last reply
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      • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

        @lerxst @mhoye the way I see it, it *should* be an ideal job for a parent (whether male, female, NB), with good opportunities to work async, part time, from home.

        Sadly structural stuff, mandatory meetings, the so many "ritual" meetings make the async part-timeness more difficult.

        lerxst@az.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
        lerxst@az.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
        lerxst@az.social
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #21

        @sarajw @mhoye So many meetings could be literally two Slack or even IRC messages per person.

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        • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

          @mhoye didn't know that either.

          Honestly man the more I learn about women in computing in history, the madder I am about the state of tech today.

          janxdevil@sfba.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
          janxdevil@sfba.socialJ This user is from outside of this forum
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          #22

          @sarajw @mhoye On that note, I recently learned about how the original group of ENIAC programmers were all women. One of them is credited with having invented the debugger breakpoint.

          hyc@mastodon.socialH 1 Reply Last reply
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          • mhoye@cosocial.caM mhoye@cosocial.ca

            On a more serious note, I didn't realize that Hamilton coined the term "software engineer".

            ryanprior@mastodon.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
            ryanprior@mastodon.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
            ryanprior@mastodon.social
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #23

            @mhoye I read that she also coined the term "test harness"

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            • mhoye@cosocial.caM mhoye@cosocial.ca

              A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

              benjamingeer@piaille.frB This user is from outside of this forum
              benjamingeer@piaille.frB This user is from outside of this forum
              benjamingeer@piaille.fr
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #24

              @mhoye On the other hand, Michael Collins did have to turn something off and on again to fix a problem

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • mhoye@cosocial.caM mhoye@cosocial.ca

                A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

                swiftone@mastodon.onlineS This user is from outside of this forum
                swiftone@mastodon.onlineS This user is from outside of this forum
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                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #25

                @mhoye I use the first pic to teach the difference between the purpose of a caption and alt text, with a guerilla casual mention of how much we owe Hamilton and similar minimized women.

                sarajw@front-end.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
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                • janxdevil@sfba.socialJ janxdevil@sfba.social

                  @sarajw @mhoye On that note, I recently learned about how the original group of ENIAC programmers were all women. One of them is credited with having invented the debugger breakpoint.

                  hyc@mastodon.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                  hyc@mastodon.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                  hyc@mastodon.social
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #26

                  @janxdevil @sarajw @mhoye yep. Kay McNulty was one of them, from just a bit up the road from my house. https://www.womensmuseumofireland.ie/exhibits/kay-mcnulty

                  hyc@mastodon.socialH 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
                    sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #27

                    @spacehobo is it just going to make me more mad or give me something constructive to do about it?

                    Otherwise nowadays I can only cope with fiction, novels, I need the escapism...

                    @lerxst @mhoye

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • hyc@mastodon.socialH hyc@mastodon.social

                      @janxdevil @sarajw @mhoye yep. Kay McNulty was one of them, from just a bit up the road from my house. https://www.womensmuseumofireland.ie/exhibits/kay-mcnulty

                      hyc@mastodon.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
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                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #28

                      @janxdevil @sarajw @mhoye they have a monument dedicated to her at her birthplace now. I like to visit it every year...

                      hyc@mastodon.socialH 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #29

                        @spacehobo @lerxst @mhoye thank you either way, I'd like to know but it might make me feel very frustrated about what could have been..

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                        • mhoye@cosocial.caM mhoye@cosocial.ca

                          A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

                          mralancooper@hachyderm.ioM This user is from outside of this forum
                          mralancooper@hachyderm.ioM This user is from outside of this forum
                          mralancooper@hachyderm.io
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #30

                          @mhoye

                          In 2017 Margaret Hamilton was inducted into the Computer History Museum's Hall of Fellows. On that occasion I was privileged to accompany her on a private, docent-guided tour of the Museum's public display.

                          She looked about the same as she does in these pictures from the 1960s, albeit a little grayer; a bright, diminutive grandma.

                          But she was very humble and human. At one point we rounded a corner into the Apollo section. Prominently in the front of the exhibit was a reproduction of your left-hand photo. Upon seeing it, Margaret stopped and exclaimed, "Oh my gosh! Is that me?"

                          mralancooper@hachyderm.ioM grumpusnation@mastodon.socialG itgrrl@infosec.exchangeI 3 Replies Last reply
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                          • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

                            @mhoye didn't know that either.

                            Honestly man the more I learn about women in computing in history, the madder I am about the state of tech today.

                            craignicol@glasgow.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                            craignicol@glasgow.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                            craignicol@glasgow.social
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #31

                            @sarajw @mhoye she coined the term to remind everyone that the software running the show was just as important as the engineering that went into the rest of the mission.

                            sarajw@front-end.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
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                            • craignicol@glasgow.socialC craignicol@glasgow.social

                              @sarajw @mhoye she coined the term to remind everyone that the software running the show was just as important as the engineering that went into the rest of the mission.

                              sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                              #32

                              @craignicol @mhoye absolutely!

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • hyc@mastodon.socialH hyc@mastodon.social

                                @janxdevil @sarajw @mhoye they have a monument dedicated to her at her birthplace now. I like to visit it every year...

                                hyc@mastodon.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
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                                #33

                                @janxdevil @sarajw @mhoye I don't recall any of these women being mentioned in my courses at UMich. But I knew Grace Hopper coined "computer bug" (but it was an actual bug, a moth, that fried itself on a circuit). Probably just picked up in outside reading. I learned about Kay from reading about ENIAC, because the EECS department had a slice of it (1/10th) on display. I learned about Margaret because... a colleague of mine at the UM Computing Center looked like her. https://websites.umich.edu/~umvm/MIDAC/midac_eniac.html

                                hyc@mastodon.socialH 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • mhoye@cosocial.caM mhoye@cosocial.ca

                                  A picture of Margaret Hamilton, programmer for the Apollo space program, standing next to not one single microsoft error message or bluetooth problem.

                                  dws@mastodon.cloudD This user is from outside of this forum
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                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #34

                                  @mhoye What's lost there to people not of a certain age is that she's standing next to Source Code Control. Diffs were done manually by setting inches-thick listings of versions of modules down side-by-side, then flipping through them to eyeball changes and make notes.

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                                  • swiftone@mastodon.onlineS swiftone@mastodon.online

                                    @mhoye I use the first pic to teach the difference between the purpose of a caption and alt text, with a guerilla casual mention of how much we owe Hamilton and similar minimized women.

                                    sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                                    sarajw@front-end.social
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #35

                                    @swiftone @mhoye do you have those examples of the caption and alt text to hand?

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                                    • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

                                      @lerxst @mhoye mmhmmm. Amazing how the women got pushed out, I guess because it was seen as something that the clever men should do and be well paid for...

                                      eons@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                                      eons@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                                      eons@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #36

                                      @sarajw @lerxst @mhoye here's a decent article on the subject (despite being on the guardian) https://www.theguardian.com/careers/2017/aug/10/how-the-tech-industry-wrote-women-out-of-history

                                      sarajw@front-end.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • eons@mastodon.gamedev.placeE eons@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                        @sarajw @lerxst @mhoye here's a decent article on the subject (despite being on the guardian) https://www.theguardian.com/careers/2017/aug/10/how-the-tech-industry-wrote-women-out-of-history

                                        sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                                        sarajw@front-end.social
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #37

                                        @eons @lerxst @mhoye thank you.

                                        I'm well aware how a lot of it happened - every time I learn a new detail it's more maddening

                                        sarajw@front-end.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • sarajw@front-end.socialS sarajw@front-end.social

                                          @eons @lerxst @mhoye thank you.

                                          I'm well aware how a lot of it happened - every time I learn a new detail it's more maddening

                                          sarajw@front-end.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
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                                          #38

                                          @eons yeeep:

                                          "But by the 1970s, there was a change in mindset and women were no longer welcome in the workplace: the government and industry had grown wise to just how powerful computers were and wanted to integrate their use at a management level. “But they weren’t going to put women workers – seen as low level drones – in charge of computers,” explains Hicks. Women were systematically phased out and replaced by men who were paid more and had better job titles."

                                          @lerxst @mhoye

                                          sarajw@front-end.socialS 1 Reply Last reply
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