What right will we have to criticize Putin if he kills Ukrainian president Zelenskyy?

[giliell@mastodon.social]

@Lats @randahl Why should he? The orange dictator loves him

[waldschnecke@chaos.social]

@randahl I lost track as when we stopped holding Politicians responsible for their actions or failings. To an extend in some countries this still seems to be the case, but under the line it's a very disappointing result.
After all; these people are supposed to represent what the majority wants or at least agrees to (to an extend).
In my brain, just arond covid things started to go sideways very fast, very extreme - but I may just have been to occupied with myself before that...

[gonzo_askold@mastodon.social]

@randahl angry but friendly phone calls

[elcelio@mastodon.uno]

@randahl as if putin needs any justification to kill Zelensky.

This line of reasoning is dangerous.

[valguard@ohai.social]

@randahl International law is a set of rules and regulations created by great powers and works only if it's enforced by great powers. The problem starts when great powers leaders are dictators, then international law exist on paper, but no one to enforce. This is the time we are living in.

[nilsmielke@det.social]

@randahl …or Trump.

[bubi352@mstdn.social]

@randahl with "we" you mean us citizens, I guess? Everything else is just whataboutism. And "legal standpoint" isn't a real thing internationally, who would enforce it?

[bubi352@mstdn.social]

@BillMcGuire @randahl trump doesn't care. He wears his merch at grievings of soldiers that were killed because of him.

[exxo@nrw.social]

@randahl You mean like preventing Putin from killing Nawalny?

To be clear: international law would be great, but right now it's dead. And game theory teaches us that it's not advantageous to be the only one sticking to it. It's just disappointing.

[xs4me2@mastodon.social]

@randahl

Exactly this indeed…

[bweller@mstdn.social]

@randahl Zelensky should attempt to kill Putin and I expect Putin is doing his level best to kill Zelensky.

I don't think that part of international law is ethical or moral. I say it's wrong.

They're in a declared war. They both send others to die. They are both ultimately soldiers and targets.

Sending others to die puts your own head on the block. Live by, die by. A good general accepts their role and consequences.

[lukefromdc@kolektiva.social]

@randahl Well, I would cheer if Zelinsky managed to kill Putin. I'd cheer even more if he was killed by a furious mob of Russians fed up with war and conscription, but the point is that Putin arrives in Hell. How he gets there is secondary,

[lukefromdc@kolektiva.social]

@tuban_muzuru @Lats @randahl Looking forward to that, thinking pikes in Red Square

[mcv@friendica.opensocial.space]

@randahl

Putin has tried several times to have Zelensky assassinated. So his complaints about the assassination of Khamenei are hypocrisy.

Furthermore, Khamenei was an illegitimate ruler, responsible for the deaths of thousands of people in recent protests. Please don't pretend he was a normal, legitimate leader. His death is fully deserved, and the Iranian people deserve freedom.

The problem with Trump's attack is that he doesn't care about those people and has no plan for regime change. His attack will hurt a lot of people inside and outside Iran, but not accomplish anything beyond making a bad situation worse. But if he does manage to overthrow that regime, I will applaud it. It would be the one positive thing he'd accomplish. But that doesn't excuse the horrible things he's done, in bringing oppression to the US, destabilising the world, and of course his pedophilia and many other personal crimes.

[cebeyon@mastodon.social]

@randahl what right? By who's Authority

[oy_rlty@mastodon.social]

@randahl leaders of most countries usually have more means and opportunities to ensure their own security than ordinary citizens. Local and international laws usually provide leaders with immunity from what they do, including vs their own population. Not sure that many people are upset that the leader of Iran, who was under numerous sanctions, who was involved in repeated executions of protesters, enjoyed impunity for 37 years, has finally died.

[ajsnook2@mastodon.social]

@oy_rlty @randahl I'd really love to see Mr Zelenski live to a ripe old age and become a natural treasure, full of anecdotes about his time in power.
Unfortunately my cynical self just sees him becoming a victim on Putin.
So sad. Really hope I'm wrong.

[halaana@mastodon.social]

@randahl What the US has done is worse than simply killing an enemies leader during war, they did it when there were ongoing negotiations. What are countries such as China meant to take from this? That peace talks are to get you to lower your guard so they can attack, and international exercises are so they can kill you when unarmed? Yes, the US isn't condemned because we don't want to admit the alliance is dead, but the perfidy is much worse than regicide.

[lindarosesmit@mastodon.social]

@randahl by we do you nean the US or all other countries?

[humainvirtuel@mastodon.social]

@randahl Putin is the aggressor, he can always be criticized, and by his actions he should definitely be free game. As for the Iranian leaders, this is a war caused by Trump and Netanyahu, it's unacceptable, no one has to unwillingly side with this.