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  3. Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

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  • quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ quoidian@mastodon.online

    @johncarlosbaez
    https://www.penguinrandomhouse.ca/books/243204/the-new-wild-by-fred-pearce/9780807039557

    johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
    johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
    johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
    wrote sidst redigeret af
    #9

    @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

    quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ moz@fosstodon.orgM cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC 3 Replies Last reply
    0
    • climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC climatejenny@biodiversity.social

      @arisummerland @johncarlosbaez I’m with you: Let the plants decide. It’s never clear how much human intervention is helpful, but the track record thus far suggests that the prudent thing is for people to do less. Maybe reintroduce some species and see if they take hold, and maybe remove “crap plants” to let plants that take longer to establish have a chance. But then stand back and let evolution do its thing.

      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
      wrote sidst redigeret af
      #10

      @ClimateJenny @arisummerland - it's possible that in the long run, fighting invasive species is a losing battle in most cases. Maybe it's better to just let succession take place: often the first stages of succession involve scrappy species that can survive tough conditions, while later a more complex ecosystem develops. But I'm no expert. I just agree with both of you that plants tends to know more about these issues than people.

      nancywisser@mastodon.socialN 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • hardly@beige.partyH hardly@beige.party

        @johncarlosbaez

        Lived half my life in the Calumet Region. Nature does thrive in some places among the heavy industry. Thanks for sharing the story.

        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
        wrote sidst redigeret af
        #11

        @hardly - sure thing! I've never been to the Calumet region.

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

          @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

          quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ This user is from outside of this forum
          quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ This user is from outside of this forum
          quoidian@mastodon.online
          wrote sidst redigeret af
          #12

          @johncarlosbaez
          Let me know your impression?

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

            @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

            moz@fosstodon.orgM This user is from outside of this forum
            moz@fosstodon.orgM This user is from outside of this forum
            moz@fosstodon.org
            wrote sidst redigeret af
            #13

            @johncarlosbaez @quoidian isn't 'pristine nature' one of those impossible ideals? I'm in Australia where we've had 100m of sea level rise since people arrived so questions like "what would nature look like here" are pretty abstract.

            "The Biggest Estate on Earth" is a book asking which bits people made.

            raphaelmorgan@disabled.socialR 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • moz@fosstodon.orgM moz@fosstodon.org

              @johncarlosbaez @quoidian isn't 'pristine nature' one of those impossible ideals? I'm in Australia where we've had 100m of sea level rise since people arrived so questions like "what would nature look like here" are pretty abstract.

              "The Biggest Estate on Earth" is a book asking which bits people made.

              raphaelmorgan@disabled.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
              raphaelmorgan@disabled.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
              raphaelmorgan@disabled.social
              wrote sidst redigeret af
              #14

              @moz @johncarlosbaez @quoidian impossible and also colonial in nature. E.g. Spaniards arriving on Turtle Island saw the way indigenous people were actively stewarding the land and demonized it, encouraging instead to leave "wilderness" without any human intervention. Now, a lot of those areas where colonists interfered with native stewardship have been doing worse off without human intervention, e.g. building up kindling for huge ecosystem-destroying wildfires instead of small controlled burns

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

                Steel mills dumped molten slag in parts of Chicago and nearby areas. The slag hardened in layers up to 5 meters deep. These places became barren wastelands. Other industries dumped hot ash and cinders there.

                But eventually the steel mills closed.

                The deep layers of hard, toxic material were not friendly to plants. Cottonwoods are usually 30 meters tall or more. In the slag fields, stunted cottonwoods grow to just 2 meters.

                But rare species that could handle these conditions began to thrive. The lakeside daisy, a federally threatened species lost to Illinois for decades, turned out to grow taller on slag than on topsoil! The capitate spike-rush, last recorded in Illinois in 1894 and considered locally extinct, was rediscovered growing on slag.

                And more! Native prairie grasses like little bluestem. Native milkweeds. Even tiny white orchids called sphinx ladies' tresses.

                A team of women ecologists began studying these unusual landscapes. They call themselves the Slag Queens.

                (1/2)

                climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                climatejenny@biodiversity.social
                wrote sidst redigeret af
                #15

                @johncarlosbaez As they point out in the article, the management decisions are highly site-specific. If it’s a wasteland for miles around, go wild with the invasives.

                But, wow. The sedge that’s been missing for more than a century? How did it get back there? One gets the impression that somewhere off in a forgotten corner, some plants have been quietly biding their time.

                johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                  Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                  She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                  Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                  And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                  Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                  The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                  • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                  Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                  (2/2)

                  blogdiva@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  blogdiva@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  blogdiva@mastodon.social
                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                  #16

                  @johncarlosbaez love Love LOVE THIS STORY SO MUCH! it’s about resilience outside of neoliberal, settler-capitalist conventions and not just from an ecological point of view; but a academic and scientist point of view as well.

                  johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                    Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                    She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                    Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                    And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                    Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                    The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                    • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                    Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                    (2/2)

                    5cifigirl@starbase80.wtf5 This user is from outside of this forum
                    5cifigirl@starbase80.wtf5 This user is from outside of this forum
                    5cifigirl@starbase80.wtf
                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                    #17

                    @johncarlosbaez

                    Their conclusion reminds a little bit of "Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind". In as beautiful a way as possible. 💖 🌿

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • blogdiva@mastodon.socialB blogdiva@mastodon.social

                      @johncarlosbaez love Love LOVE THIS STORY SO MUCH! it’s about resilience outside of neoliberal, settler-capitalist conventions and not just from an ecological point of view; but a academic and scientist point of view as well.

                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                      #18

                      @blogdiva - yeah, it's full of deep points. You'd probably enjoy the longer version I linked to, if you haven't already read it.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC climatejenny@biodiversity.social

                        @johncarlosbaez As they point out in the article, the management decisions are highly site-specific. If it’s a wasteland for miles around, go wild with the invasives.

                        But, wow. The sedge that’s been missing for more than a century? How did it get back there? One gets the impression that somewhere off in a forgotten corner, some plants have been quietly biding their time.

                        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ This user is from outside of this forum
                        johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz
                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                        #19

                        @ClimateJenny - reminds me of how Felis silvestris is showing up in parts of Europe where human populations are declining.

                        https://mathstodon.xyz/@johncarlosbaez/115911764922880272

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                          Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

                          Steel mills dumped molten slag in parts of Chicago and nearby areas. The slag hardened in layers up to 5 meters deep. These places became barren wastelands. Other industries dumped hot ash and cinders there.

                          But eventually the steel mills closed.

                          The deep layers of hard, toxic material were not friendly to plants. Cottonwoods are usually 30 meters tall or more. In the slag fields, stunted cottonwoods grow to just 2 meters.

                          But rare species that could handle these conditions began to thrive. The lakeside daisy, a federally threatened species lost to Illinois for decades, turned out to grow taller on slag than on topsoil! The capitate spike-rush, last recorded in Illinois in 1894 and considered locally extinct, was rediscovered growing on slag.

                          And more! Native prairie grasses like little bluestem. Native milkweeds. Even tiny white orchids called sphinx ladies' tresses.

                          A team of women ecologists began studying these unusual landscapes. They call themselves the Slag Queens.

                          (1/2)

                          c5b6340b29d13ead3f1625dce57511dabd6efcfbc929b5544fbaa564994d51f3@mostr.pubC This user is from outside of this forum
                          c5b6340b29d13ead3f1625dce57511dabd6efcfbc929b5544fbaa564994d51f3@mostr.pubC This user is from outside of this forum
                          c5b6340b29d13ead3f1625dce57511dabd6efcfbc929b5544fbaa564994d51f3@mostr.pub
                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                          #20
                          I've always wanted to get my hands on a slag queen.
                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                            Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                            She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                            Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                            And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                            Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                            The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                            • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                            Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                            (2/2)

                            kateconnors@masto.aiK This user is from outside of this forum
                            kateconnors@masto.aiK This user is from outside of this forum
                            kateconnors@masto.ai
                            wrote sidst redigeret af
                            #21

                            @johncarlosbaez How much do I love this story? Let me count the ways. . .or never mind. It's just singularly delightful!

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                              @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

                              cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC This user is from outside of this forum
                              cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC This user is from outside of this forum
                              cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nz
                              wrote sidst redigeret af
                              #22

                              @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                              I think there is a perception that resources for invasive species management are directed at any invasive species wherever they may occur simply because it is non-native. Or that the concern about invasive species impacts (and scientific work on the topic) are unobjective and inappropriately value laden. The reality is that the vast majority of invasive species are largely or completely unmanageable, and most interventions must be defensible from a variety of perspectives before the limited resources that may be available are invested. As someone who has lived and worked on oceanic islands a lot, invasive species' impacts are very conspicuous. Their impacts also create ethical dilemmas in relation to the fate of endemic biodiversity. Functional equivalency arguments don't hold up IMO as they seem to reflect our tendency to view nature as being there primarily to serve human needs. I think this slag heap site acting as refuge for specialist native species is cool, but the story says only a little about the legitimacy, ethics or complexity of our concerns about invasive species - these intersect with so many different aspects of the environment, human health and welfare.

                              cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nz

                                @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                I think there is a perception that resources for invasive species management are directed at any invasive species wherever they may occur simply because it is non-native. Or that the concern about invasive species impacts (and scientific work on the topic) are unobjective and inappropriately value laden. The reality is that the vast majority of invasive species are largely or completely unmanageable, and most interventions must be defensible from a variety of perspectives before the limited resources that may be available are invested. As someone who has lived and worked on oceanic islands a lot, invasive species' impacts are very conspicuous. Their impacts also create ethical dilemmas in relation to the fate of endemic biodiversity. Functional equivalency arguments don't hold up IMO as they seem to reflect our tendency to view nature as being there primarily to serve human needs. I think this slag heap site acting as refuge for specialist native species is cool, but the story says only a little about the legitimacy, ethics or complexity of our concerns about invasive species - these intersect with so many different aspects of the environment, human health and welfare.

                                cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC This user is from outside of this forum
                                cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC This user is from outside of this forum
                                cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nz
                                wrote sidst redigeret af
                                #23

                                @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                TL;DR people concerned about invasive species and advocating for some action are more aware than most about how unattainable some vision of "pristine nature" is. #IAS #biodiversity #anthropocene

                                quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ redrobyn@mastodon.nzR 2 Replies Last reply
                                0
                                • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                                  Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                                  She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                                  Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                                  And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                                  Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                                  The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                                  • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                                  Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                                  (2/2)

                                  W This user is from outside of this forum
                                  W This user is from outside of this forum
                                  woo@fosstodon.org
                                  wrote sidst redigeret af
                                  #24

                                  @johncarlosbaez As a child, I used to play (against my Mother's wishes) on an area of grey coal-mining slag in the Cannock Chase coal-field. It's now in recovery and a local farmer has been tree planting, to supplement the willows that naturally grew along the brook. The trees are protected by fence from the deer that have moved into the area, to escape the noise and disruption of an area of housing development a couple of Miles away. In the summer there are butterflies and dragon-flies.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                                    Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

                                    Steel mills dumped molten slag in parts of Chicago and nearby areas. The slag hardened in layers up to 5 meters deep. These places became barren wastelands. Other industries dumped hot ash and cinders there.

                                    But eventually the steel mills closed.

                                    The deep layers of hard, toxic material were not friendly to plants. Cottonwoods are usually 30 meters tall or more. In the slag fields, stunted cottonwoods grow to just 2 meters.

                                    But rare species that could handle these conditions began to thrive. The lakeside daisy, a federally threatened species lost to Illinois for decades, turned out to grow taller on slag than on topsoil! The capitate spike-rush, last recorded in Illinois in 1894 and considered locally extinct, was rediscovered growing on slag.

                                    And more! Native prairie grasses like little bluestem. Native milkweeds. Even tiny white orchids called sphinx ladies' tresses.

                                    A team of women ecologists began studying these unusual landscapes. They call themselves the Slag Queens.

                                    (1/2)

                                    stevenheywood@mastodonapp.ukS This user is from outside of this forum
                                    stevenheywood@mastodonapp.ukS This user is from outside of this forum
                                    stevenheywood@mastodonapp.uk
                                    wrote sidst redigeret af
                                    #25

                                    @johncarlosbaez
                                    Over on this side of the pond one of the conspicuous ironies is the large proportion of Sites of Special Scientific Interest and nature reserves that have industrial origins.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyzJ johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz

                                      @ClimateJenny @arisummerland - it's possible that in the long run, fighting invasive species is a losing battle in most cases. Maybe it's better to just let succession take place: often the first stages of succession involve scrappy species that can survive tough conditions, while later a more complex ecosystem develops. But I'm no expert. I just agree with both of you that plants tends to know more about these issues than people.

                                      nancywisser@mastodon.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
                                      nancywisser@mastodon.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
                                      nancywisser@mastodon.social
                                      wrote sidst redigeret af
                                      #26

                                      @johncarlosbaez @ClimateJenny @arisummerland If you've spent your life loving and looking at the native plants of your area it's still heartbreaking to see them go though. Small wonder people fight to keep them even when it's a fool's errand.

                                      climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nzC cbuddenhagen@mastodon.nz

                                        @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                        TL;DR people concerned about invasive species and advocating for some action are more aware than most about how unattainable some vision of "pristine nature" is. #IAS #biodiversity #anthropocene

                                        quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ This user is from outside of this forum
                                        quoidian@mastodon.onlineQ This user is from outside of this forum
                                        quoidian@mastodon.online
                                        wrote sidst redigeret af
                                        #27

                                        @cbuddenhagen @johncarlosbaez
                                        I live where a 2 km block of ice shifted the last interglacial thaw, betimes a long distance. Every species here, now, is an invasive species that could adapt to a climate regime that is now ending. If there are fewer blackflies in the new Ontario that emerges, I'd be happy.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • nancywisser@mastodon.socialN nancywisser@mastodon.social

                                          @johncarlosbaez @ClimateJenny @arisummerland If you've spent your life loving and looking at the native plants of your area it's still heartbreaking to see them go though. Small wonder people fight to keep them even when it's a fool's errand.

                                          climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                          climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                                          climatejenny@biodiversity.social
                                          wrote sidst redigeret af
                                          #28

                                          @nancywisser @johncarlosbaez @arisummerland Not a fool’s errand! Every plant you can save holds the possibility of being the one who can re-emerge later when conditions are right. All biodiversity is precious, and we can’t predict which species is going to be crucial later on.

                                          What’s worse is that we don’t have, and probably never will have, the tools to replicate intact ecosystems. The plants are very clever, but our so-called civilization is a bad neighbor. Keep conserving. #NativePlants

                                          climatejenny@biodiversity.socialC nancywisser@mastodon.socialN arisummerland@beige.partyA 3 Replies Last reply
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