Employer wants me to sign an IP agreement saying they own software I wrote two years before I started working there

[maybe_mbk@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft

I worked briefly for a startup that had a clause that would give them IP over all "inventions" I made in my private life during the time of employment. I signed anyway, because (German) courts had already declared clauses like this null and void. Business idiots gotta idiot. But even they had enough common sense to not demand stuff before my time at their company.

The more interesting question is: what if you refuse to sign? BTW, the answers on Reddit look kind of decent.

[kaasbaas@social.oevents.co.za]

@nixCraft this sounds kinda crazy.

Flip it the other way - would it be sane and legal to claim ownership of anything you make AFTER you leave a corpo?

I mean...what the heck??

[chris1776@mastodon.bsd.cafe]

@nixCraft He should ask a lawyer, not reddit.

[alexander_outten@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft DeTeWe Shipton Communications tried that on me in 1994 after I'd been working there for 3 years, retrospective IP rights. Unsurprisingly I walked

[raymaccarthy@mastodon.ie]

@nixCraft
Companies want to treat employees as chattels and serfs.

[mwl@io.mwl.io]

@nixCraft they can ask for whatever they want.

It's our job to say no.

I have had many high-level jobs and always negotiated my IP agreements.

[bandersnatch@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft

Tell them to fuck off and find a new job.

[wtl@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft That's batshit insane.

[dzajew@social.dzajew.xyz]

@nixCraft
Wtf

[slargentina@rebel.ar]

@nixCraft very risky and obvious but i would request a payment first

[cliffsesport@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft surprised no lawyers have weighted in, as written wouldn't this also be an attempt to claim ownership for work done for previous employers?

[mcr314@todon.nl]

@nixCraft open source licenses are joint licenses, so one can "hand over", yet that has no effect on anyone else. What they want is ownership over any future contribution, and since those have to comply with the license. That's a reason the GPL was created in the 1980s.

[shredderfeeder@shredderfood.com]

@nixCraft I think the key phrase here is "If they relate to, could be useful to, or arise from the company's current or anticipated business."

Pretty sure a tabletop RPG management app doesn't related to your employment...

But my response would be "Well then run it through legal because I'm not signing it over."

The whole thing is bullshit, since when does an employer have a right to ANYTHING that took place before employment?

[petealexharris@mastodon.scot]

@mcr314 @nixCraft

Could agree to give them a perpetual non-exclusive license to the code and print them off a copy of the GPL (or BSD license or whatever)

[hankg@friendica.myportal.social]

@kevin @nixCraft @kattebel They already are employed there though. When I first read this I thought it was about a company hiring someone. Doing it after the fact makes this maneuver even more egregious.

[paul_ipv6@infosec.exchange]

@nixCraft

i'd talk to a lawyer but from my experience, no they can't. the purpose of enumerating prior art is exactly so they *can't* claim ownership of your prior work and you can't claim ownership of work you do for them once you're working for them.

lawyers love to put things in contracts that are blatant overreach in the hopes you'll just sign it. they are used to redlines to cut out such stuff too.

[galacticstone@mastodon.social]

@nixCraft Refuse to sign and tender your resignation. Start shopping your resume yesterday.

[pomcountyirregs@mstdn.social]

@nixCraft Well, as this non-attorney understands it, a copyright’s ownership can be transferred by written agreement. (Usually, there’s payment.) If I’m correct, then they can certainly ask. But, all those who licensed from you before still have their license.

Any way, they can ask. Asking, though, might be a red flag. After all if you leave their employment they will not give you back your copyright.

[mcv@friendica.opensocial.space]

@Lacey @nixCraft

They included the vague and ill defined "or anticipated".

It's a bad contract and shouldn't hold up in court (if the court was reasonable), even if you weren't being pressured to sign under duress.

It's certainly not standard and I would never sign something like this.

[mcv@friendica.opensocial.space]

@galacticstone @nixCraft

Don't resign, let them fire you. They're in the wrong here. Don't do their dirty work for them.