This is the future those who push for age verification want for us.

[failedlyndonlarouchite@mas.to]

@Gargron

as far as I can tell, a large majority of people are ok with giving up their privacy, if they think it will reduce crime

and of course, the media constantly tell us how things like CCTV reduce crime, to everyone thinks that giving up their privacy will in fact reduce crime

[babe@glitterkitten.co.uk]

@Gargron This is one of my major worries with the OSA. There's no real regulation of the companies who are providing age verification services. A lot aren't clear on information they retain or for how long. We're building vast databases of personal information with little transparency on things like security around it. We're going to see some enormous data leaks in the coming years.

[mischi2000@social.inselleben.chat]

@Gargron@mastodon.social
I consider this type of age verification to be very negligent and pointless.

It would be more important to teach children how to use social media responsibly and how to recognize fake news and the like from a very early age – YES, IN SCHOOL.

[anderslund@expressional.social]

@Gargron In denmark, Datastyrelsen (the state office caring for data) released an "altID" app, which can be used as an ID, IRL or online. After creation, data stays on your device, and what clients get is an age or identity verification, and you get to choose what to share. They failed to make it open source, but given it does what the say it does, it at least better than scanning passports etc, I believe. It is derived from an EU model afaik. And I was able to install it on my google-free /e/os fairphone. FWIW.

[_ryekdarkener_@mastodon.social]

@Gargron

The future is not "leak". The future is access for everyone who pays enough. Legally.

[harib_murshidi@mastodon.social]

@mischi2000 @Gargron Just leave parenting to parents, the world does not need 'nanny states'.

[mjj@mstdn.dk]

@anderslund @Gargron It was built to integrate with the European eID, yes.

[ayumiaki@mastodon.social]

@Gargron The scary part is the structural pattern: a high-value credential gets press-ganged into a low-value auth system that has zero incentive to secure it. Passports prove citizenship — they shouldnt be a cookie for pot shops.

Age verification needs an architectural boundary: prove you are old enough without proving who you are. Its solvable. The political will is the bottleneck.

[anderslund@expressional.social]

@mjj @Gargron ... and I think it is a good idea, although I am critical towards requireing identification for stuff like social networks, and using it to deny young people access to knowledge, etc. They have a similar app in Netherlands, and probably more on the way throughout europe.

[mischi2000@social.inselleben.chat]

@harib_murshidi@mastodon.social

Yes, I agree with you there, but I also feel I must and want to hold politicians and governments accountable. Proper legal frameworks must be established for large social networks. It must be possible to hold these networks accountable much more easily and quickly.

@Gargron@mastodon.social

[solitha@mastodon.social]

@anderslund Maybe I'm thinking way too far into this, but it seems to me that any data given that verifies you, is a form of ID that can be stolen. Your "altID" is still ID.

@Gargron

[b3lt3r@mastodon.b3lt3r.com]

@Gargron I am so fed up with ID being passed to external companies with no understanding or validation of what they do with it. One of the main companies used in the UK, Persona, was co-founded by Thiel. How on earth can *any* trust be put in any of his companies.

Lots of arguments about the how, but actually I strongly question the why. I simply do not believe the "protect the children" mantra. The goal is worthy, the method is not.

[anderslund@expressional.social]

@solitha @Gargron You have to trust the software involved, that is true. And hold on to your device The data sent to clients is a boolean in case of age verification, ID shouldn't only be given to trustworthy services.

[rickd6@mstdn.ca]

@Gargron @ayumiaki I believe that it’s actually the influence of the maga wealthy that is the problem. Too many politicians are more worried about their positions than they are about their constituents, or the truth.

[erka@infosec.exchange]

There is a case to be made for a safe age verification for online communities for minors.

Back in the good times when the US government tried to be part of a solution, president Obama’s Cyber Czar put out a proposal for a brokered verfication service to keep adults (potential groomers and pdfs) out of online games and services designed for school kids.

The student registries would’ve served as a source for identity and age verification and the individual app or an endpoint device would then be minted an anonymous proof of age.

It never materialised but the idea was compelling.

[solitha@mastodon.social]

@Gargron I wonder if there is a future ahead of us in which all forms of identification documentation are so devalued as to be useless.

[erka@infosec.exchange]

The search word would be ”National Strategy for Tusted Identities in Cyberspace”.

I see the paper was released ten years ago, when the US presidents still adhered to record-keeping requirements and preserved official documents for posterity.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/NSTICstrategy_041511.pdf

[pantheonw@kcmo.social]

@solitha

@Gargron
Is there also in that future a requirement for a difficult to obtain high value form of identification required to participate in elections?

[solitha@mastodon.social]

@anderslund What I'm trying to say (probably not well, it's hard to put into words) is that having your altID leaked/stolen doesn't feel functionally different to me than, say, this passport leak.

It's an ID masking your ID, but still has the whole value of any set of credentials.

Of course, as you said, physical possession of the device... which is also true of any credentials.

@Gargron

[solitha@mastodon.social]

@pantheonw All I can think of that would be left if documentation was devalued, would be biometrics.

And *that's* a whole 'nother can of worms.

@Gargron