#Military secrets are fiercely guarded for obvious reasons.
-
@NathanMurdock @benroyce Uh, have we forgotten that Russia is the aggressor who can call it quits and go back to not attacking a sovereign nation unprovoked at any point? Nobody's backing them into any corners here. You're giving some real, "But what was Ukraine wearing when it was raped?" energy with this comment.
You are right.
Myself, I heard the voice of Russia Today in that reply. -
I think it's possible Russia could use a nuke
But the real issue is how we respond to that threat
If we freak out and give into demands that means we reward such behavior. Thus there will be more nuke threats (and more countries making them) thus increasing the chances of nuke use
The only valid response to a nuke threat is assurances that Moscow and St Petersburg will cease to exist if they use a nuke
This response alone delivers the smallest chance of nuke use
@benroyce @gabriel @NathanMurdock
I would like to add, that Putin and his Allies should cease to exist in that case, too. He does mit care for a few hundreds of thousands of lives. -
@benroyce @gabriel @NathanMurdock
I would like to add, that Putin and his Allies should cease to exist in that case, too. He does mit care for a few hundreds of thousands of lives.@DerJoshDer @gabriel @NathanMurdock
Good point. You could almost say that if Russia threatens to nuke anyone, a promise to manhunt and kill Putin and his associates with all available military capacity, if they use a nuke, is probably a more effective deterrent than a threat to nuke back
-
@DerJoshDer @gabriel @NathanMurdock
Good point. You could almost say that if Russia threatens to nuke anyone, a promise to manhunt and kill Putin and his associates with all available military capacity, if they use a nuke, is probably a more effective deterrent than a threat to nuke back
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock yeah, there is probably a storm shadow/hellfire suppository waiting for Russian leadership if nukes.
-
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock yeah, there is probably a storm shadow/hellfire suppository waiting for Russian leadership if nukes.
@gabriel @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock
Even so, I would not be surprised if Ukraine has secretly built a nuke and shown proof to Putin. They have the capacity
And I think this would upset a lot of people in the West but it would not upset me at all
-
#Military secrets are fiercely guarded for obvious reasons. But also obviously in a #war your enemy gets a lot of exposure to the operating parameters, capabilities, and weaknesses of your #technology. And gets plenty of physical samples
So #Ukraine just open sourced all of #Russia's military secrets
Well not strictly, it's only for allies
And a knock-on effect is it devalues Russian arms sales because potential buyers know it's all exposed
It's called #TrophyLab
@benroyce Weird, I thought the War Thunder Forums was the usual place for this sorta thing
-
@benroyce Weird, I thought the War Thunder Forums was the usual place for this sorta thing
War Thunder forums crying with rage now, they've been made redundant -
@gabriel @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock
Even so, I would not be surprised if Ukraine has secretly built a nuke and shown proof to Putin. They have the capacity
And I think this would upset a lot of people in the West but it would not upset me at all
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock I wouldn't go that far to be honest. This is a conventional war. Had no reason to become a nuclear one. Nobody wants to conquer Russia. Using nukes would escalate everything globally. The math doesn't need to involve Ukr having a secret nuke.
-
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock I wouldn't go that far to be honest. This is a conventional war. Had no reason to become a nuclear one. Nobody wants to conquer Russia. Using nukes would escalate everything globally. The math doesn't need to involve Ukr having a secret nuke.
@gabriel @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock
For you
For me
But for Ukraine?
Not as anything offensive of course. Strictly for the typical M.A.D. scenario of "if you nuke me i nuke you"
-
@gabriel @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock
For you
For me
But for Ukraine?
Not as anything offensive of course. Strictly for the typical M.A.D. scenario of "if you nuke me i nuke you"
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock not at this stage. Not even for them. They need massive amounts of drones. AI enabled. You don't need nukes to win. See the fate of the black sea fleet. Huge, expensive, capable of massive devastation. Took out by comparatively cheap drones.
Same with air defense, refineries, weapons plants, etc. nukes are terror weapons. A tactical nuke does not do much damage. They have conventional bombs that do similar damage but without the fallout.
-
@benroyce @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock not at this stage. Not even for them. They need massive amounts of drones. AI enabled. You don't need nukes to win. See the fate of the black sea fleet. Huge, expensive, capable of massive devastation. Took out by comparatively cheap drones.
Same with air defense, refineries, weapons plants, etc. nukes are terror weapons. A tactical nuke does not do much damage. They have conventional bombs that do similar damage but without the fallout.
@gabriel @DerJoshDer @NathanMurdock
well said and agreed
however, i am simply not surprised if ukraine built a nuke or plans to. they're dealing with russia. russia is stupid and only understands simple things. russia really could use a nuke. all of the rational reasons why that's stupid don't mean anything because it's russia we're talking about. ukraine understands that problem better than anyone. thus when dealing with such stupidity "if you nuke me i'll nuke you back" has to be said
-
I think it's possible Russia could use a nuke
But the real issue is how we respond to that threat
If we freak out and give into demands that means we reward such behavior. Thus there will be more nuke threats (and more countries making them) thus increasing the chances of nuke use
The only valid response to a nuke threat is assurances that Moscow and St Petersburg will cease to exist if they use a nuke
This response alone delivers the smallest chance of nuke use
@benroyce @gabriel @NathanMurdock
AFAIK NATO doctrine stipulates any minor-scale nuclear attack (utilisation of tactical nukes or dirty bombs; critically attacking civil nuclear infrastructure) will be countered with an 'overwhelming conventional response'.
Putin knows NATO still has some nasty stuff in their back pocket below the nuclear threshold.
My very personal guess is that German Taurus have not been released for that very reason.
-
J jwcph@helvede.net shared this topic
