For Black folk that didn't grow up speaking Spanish *only*:
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@mekkaokereke I saw an Instagram reel the other day that said the answer to why aren’t there more black people on ARG’s team was because their war for independence against Spain in the early 1800s promised freedom for slaves if they enlisted, so many black people died on the front lines, then Argentina won but waited 40yrs to grant emancipation so most fled to Brazil instead of waiting.
@mathowie
It's a bit more complex than that. In the early 1800s, there wasn't an Argentina yet. It was a collection of provinces that did whatever they wanted, with some semblances of union sometimes. And the Year 13 (1813) Assembly (Asamblea del año 13) did grant freedom of wombs to slaves. But Argentina's constitution was only finally written and signed in the 1850s.
Many Black people died in the war of Paraguay, an utter carnage where, as Mekka says, they were sent as fodder.
@mekkaokereke -
@mathowie
It's a bit more complex than that. In the early 1800s, there wasn't an Argentina yet. It was a collection of provinces that did whatever they wanted, with some semblances of union sometimes. And the Year 13 (1813) Assembly (Asamblea del año 13) did grant freedom of wombs to slaves. But Argentina's constitution was only finally written and signed in the 1850s.
Many Black people died in the war of Paraguay, an utter carnage where, as Mekka says, they were sent as fodder.
@mekkaokereke@mathowie The war of Paraguay was a particularly sorry business where IIRC world powers, through Argentina, Brasil and Uruguay, tried to curbstomp Paraguay, who were developing in a way Britain did not particularly like. The war dead meant Paraguay's ratio of women to men took ages to rebalance, IIRC. And still they didn't exactly lose.
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@blogdiva @mekkaokereke @mathowie
...okay, all that gives some additional context to why #PeterThiel moved to Argentina.
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For Black folk that didn't grow up speaking Spanish *only*:
Question:
* Why don't the other South American fans like Argentina?* Why do so many of the good and kind players and fans from Argentina
️
️make such a big point of being vocally anti-racist?* Why did nazis choose Argentina?
* Why do most countries in South America have people that are Black, white, indigenous, and mixed, but Argentina (and Uruguay) seem super white?
Answer:
Blanqueamiento.
History tends to only talk about the ethnic cleansing campaigns that *almost* worked. It skips over ones that *did* work
Oh this explains why Peter Thiel just fled to Argentina.
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For Black folk that didn't grow up speaking Spanish *only*:
Question:
* Why don't the other South American fans like Argentina?* Why do so many of the good and kind players and fans from Argentina
️️make such a big point of being vocally anti-racist?* Why did nazis choose Argentina?
* Why do most countries in South America have people that are Black, white, indigenous, and mixed, but Argentina (and Uruguay) seem super white?
Answer:
Blanqueamiento.
History tends to only talk about the ethnic cleansing campaigns that *almost* worked. It skips over ones that *did* work
@mekkaokereke I work in a Latino workplace and I was shocked that my coworkers were rooting for England, but they gently explained it to me.
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@mathowie The war of Paraguay was a particularly sorry business where IIRC world powers, through Argentina, Brasil and Uruguay, tried to curbstomp Paraguay, who were developing in a way Britain did not particularly like. The war dead meant Paraguay's ratio of women to men took ages to rebalance, IIRC. And still they didn't exactly lose.
@adriano
You know, I learned a little about the devastating losses in Paraguay in middle school, but somehow they skipped over the colonialism and racism entirely!
@mathowie @mekkaokereke -
@adriano
You know, I learned a little about the devastating losses in Paraguay in middle school, but somehow they skipped over the colonialism and racism entirely!
@mathowie @mekkaokereke@gnate Argentinian middle/high school did go over the colonialism in partial ways, but yeah, the racism was somehow not present in the discussion. @mathowie @mekkaokereke
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@gnate Argentinian middle/high school did go over the colonialism in partial ways, but yeah, the racism was somehow not present in the discussion. @mathowie @mekkaokereke
the thing is, Black Argentinians exist. without them there would be no tango. tango is afroargentinian music. their ministerio de cultura even has a TL:DR on the topic:
https://www.cultura.gob.ar/el-origen-negro-del-tango_6929/Carlos Gardel was basically the Elvis Presley of tango: a white guy face engineered to appropriate a popular cultural trend that was created by Black people.
it serves the racistas purpose to perpetuate the myth there are no afro/indigenous argentines.
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@mekkaokereke I work in a Latino workplace and I was shocked that my coworkers were rooting for England, but they gently explained it to me.
@mossyfoot @mekkaokereke a real “lesser of two evils” situation. (Although if the UK is the *lesser* evil, hoo boy!)
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@mekkaokereke don't let's forget that the Catholic Church helped a whole bunch of Nazis escape to argentina. And is it really silly to suggest it caused this?
Many Nazis also went to the USA, with jobs and family, and that alone does not explain the racism in the USA
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@javi @mekkaokereke the thing is: ethnic categories should no exist. I might understand if a company is taking that in account for a DEI or similar quota, but entering a country?
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@blogdiva @adriano @gnate @mathowie @mekkaokereke
This is also Argentina: https://youtu.be/qcG-xQud9A0
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For Black folk that didn't grow up speaking Spanish *only*:
Question:
* Why don't the other South American fans like Argentina?* Why do so many of the good and kind players and fans from Argentina
️️make such a big point of being vocally anti-racist?* Why did nazis choose Argentina?
* Why do most countries in South America have people that are Black, white, indigenous, and mixed, but Argentina (and Uruguay) seem super white?
Answer:
Blanqueamiento.
History tends to only talk about the ethnic cleansing campaigns that *almost* worked. It skips over ones that *did* work
@mekkaokereke the Brazilian empire tried a similar thing in the South, which is why there are many German and Italian descendants there (like me), who were sent over to colonize some parts of the land that were still untamed (even though there was a lot of black people already in Brazil who needed land)
It was (afaik) a much smaller effort, fortunately, and today there’s a fair amount of ethnic diversity in those places (even if less than the rest of the country)
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@mekkaokereke this is my late grandfather, tell me I don't have African blood (see pic).
Every time I went to US or UK and sometimes when applying to remote positions I had to fill in a form asking for race (sorry, "ethnicity"), as if this was the XIXth century. What am I supposed to say? White? Latino? Can I say black (no, of course not)?
And don't get me started about nationality: https://en.osm.town/@mdione/116923688553896688
See also https://bolha.us/@personalescrito/116926070630965836 about the African roots of our national music.
@mdione @mekkaokereke mi abuelo era bastante parecido también
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@BrKloeckner @mekkaokereke Your point about language is a good one, and another (if non-biological) reason to be careful here. English and French do have a great deal in common. (After all, we stole more than half our vocabulary from you!). But it's precisely at the margins where meanings can be elusive and false friends abound.
@marcas @BrKloeckner @mekkaokereke in Dutch the term "ras" is similarly used in biology, but in English I think there's also the term "breed" that is used in contexts like that, such as with dogs.
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@blogdiva @mekkaokereke @mathowie
...okay, all that gives some additional context to why #PeterThiel moved to Argentina.
@juergen_hubert @blogdiva @mekkaokereke @mathowie i would've drawn the line between Nazi ratlines and Thiel, but i didn't realize how long the history of white supremacy in Argentina is.
thank you all for teaching us this history
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What "race" is Ronda Rousey?
She didn't even know that she was 12.5% Black until DNA tests told her.
Which side of Blanqueamiento should she be on? Killer or victim?
Is Ronda Rousey Blacker or whiter than Meisha Tate? Could we even answer that without a DNA test?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WdwTOy7ZH1M
The point is:
Race isn't real. Racism is very real.The entire concept of race was just invented one day by a weird guy in Portugal (Gomes Eanes de Zurara) to justify slavery, and the whole world has been running with it ever since.
It's silly.
It would be funny if it weren't so genocidal.
@mekkaokereke "Black AF History: the un-whitewashed History of America" by Michael Harriot talks about this.
Race was created to justify the owning of Black slaves by claiming their race was inferior to the European(white, and later Murikkkan) race.
And no, idc what race she is, I'll cook her a protein rich dinner all the same
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For Black folk that didn't grow up speaking Spanish *only*:
Question:
* Why don't the other South American fans like Argentina?* Why do so many of the good and kind players and fans from Argentina
️️make such a big point of being vocally anti-racist?* Why did nazis choose Argentina?
* Why do most countries in South America have people that are Black, white, indigenous, and mixed, but Argentina (and Uruguay) seem super white?
Answer:
Blanqueamiento.
History tends to only talk about the ethnic cleansing campaigns that *almost* worked. It skips over ones that *did* work
@mekkaokereke In the first half of the last century there was a proverb in Europe: "Rich as an Argentinian". Not because all Argentinians were rich - more the opposite, but because all we saw in Europe was the entitled white offspring of European royalty that went to Argentina centuries ago.
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Many Nazis also went to the USA, with jobs and family, and that alone does not explain the racism in the USA
@veroandi @mekkaokereke @deepmud AIUI, the Nazis modelled their policies on the Jim Crow laws in the USA. They weren't bringing their values to a new place, so much as moving to their spiritual home.
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