I hate this timeline so much.

[flowermob@mastodon.social]

I hate this timeline so much.

[xs4me2@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob

[_r@donotsta.re]

@Flowermob has anyone ever considered that this person is lying btw?

[renardboy@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob I don't know that it's a fact but I like to think information is like seeds that take a while to grow.

Cause like, you can tell someone something that goes against their core beliefs, and there's about zero chance they'll just recompile their entire world view on the spot right?

But then afterwards they're gonna be thinking back on it and if they can't resolve the holes they'll start the long process of fixing their world view, so you will in fact have helped.

[renardboy@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob I am aware many people are not motivated enough by self-betterment to do this, but many are. Possibly equally many, who knows.

I've changed my mind several times in my life after being given good counter-arguments, but never on the spot. It takes time to internally reflect on something and tie back all the ends it makes loose.

When it's someone I know and have the opportunity to thank for helping me grow I do so, but when it's someone I have no contact with, well, I can't do that.

[davep@infosec.exchange]

@Flowermob I'm stuck in some sort of logical trap trying to parse that.

[nddev@infosec.space]

@Flowermob

I don't think you do.

/jk

[disorderlyf@todon.eu]

@Flowermob I do think part of that is how much stigma there apparently is around admitting you're wrong. I noticed I got in a lot less fights and the fights I got into disengaged a lot quicker when I got over my shit and started saying shit like "yeah, when you put it that way, I think you might be right." or "I looked into it and it turns out I was wrong."

[d1@autistics.life]

@Flowermob Alas, it was only during "the Age of Enlightenment" when facts held some sort of place of pride. Now we live in "the Age of narcissists". It matters how big your audience is, and how compelling of an emotional appeal you can make, based on true-ish, passionate statements. It's just a bunch of so-called "Narcissistic shared fantasies" now, pretty much everyone wandering and bumbling - precisely like medieval buffoons - into various toxic, cult-like ideologies

[mammaj@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob Random guys on the internet “my opinion is right” irrespective of any feedback or fact.
This is the drivel AI is trained on and we are all being cajoled or enticed to invite it into our lives. Alongside all the other spy tech (anything termed ‘smart’) already baked into everything.
The dystopian novelists warned us…

[askpippa@c.im]

@Flowermob Sometimes it works -- at least a little. I've had online discussions where I've presented facts which lead to several encouraging exchanges. Being able to explain things helps too. Don't just say "it's X!" -- link to an excellent source that explains it. You know you've made a difference if they start asking questions. It's super important to keep a neutral and friendly tone. And also know when to quit if the fact-approach doesn't show any promise.

[hunterz@mastodon.sdf.org]

@_r @Flowermob yeah this seems like too perfect of a setup

[newhereish@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob The take away of this is that science works, and that doesn't change how people think.

[shironeko@fedi.tesaguri.club]

@Flowermob it would have created a contradiction otherwise, this guy just saved the universe.

[badtux@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob People *do* change their minds when you show them facts -- but not the person you're arguing with. When I'm arguing, I'm arguing for the sake of the audience, those who have no oar in either boat and can be persuaded to either side. i already realize that for example a hardcore Notsee is not going to change his mind about what should be done with untermenschen. I argue for the sake of keeping gullible kids from adopting the same horrifying ideology, not to convince him of anything.

[caileangallimore@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob
What is "True" depends on who you talked to.
Facts, not so much.

[sanguish@iosdev.space]

@Flowermob I think the datte must be wrong by about 10 years on the quote

[pizzademon@mastodon.online]

@Flowermob

[gdinwiddie@mastodon.social]

@Flowermob I think planting questions may be more effective than facts. If they grow, they can trigger the thrill of discovery.

[iveyline@mastodon.nz]

@Flowermob Alternative facts sgain?