Hmmm
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@pglux.bsky.social An idea though, right? Not more. It is not costed or fully planned?
@jon @pglux.bsky.social it has a wikipedia page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HH_Tunnel and according to that page at least one feasibility study / pre study
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And damn there is another one
DG Regio lists
Helsingør [DK] - Helsingborg [SE]
the former rail ferry, and mentioned as a future location of a bridge or tunnelBut if I include former train ferries where am I going to stop?
Or are they eventually going to put a fixed link there?
I think the answer here is NOT to include former rail ferries (Gedser-Rostock and Helsingør-Helsingborg are not coming back), and working out where there were rail ferries is going to result in some weird outcomes
But anything with an idea to build a rail line - so including Helsingør-Helsingborg and Helsinki-Tallinn - ought to be included
And the latter I have visited - by ferry
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Hmmm
The 2017 DG Regio report on #CrossBorderRail lines lists
Chalupki [PL] - Bohumín-Vrbice [CZ]as separate from
Chalupki [PL] - Bohumín [CZ]Because there is a connecting curve here:
https://openrailwaymap.org/?style=standard&lat=49.89919574726048&lon=18.33721160888672&zoom=141) Is there any passenger train on that curve? @wrzlbrnft do you know?
2) Is there any point listing them separately, as the cross border track section is the same?
@jon If ORM is correct there aren't any switches on the chech side connecting those tracks, so that these are technically just two single track lines that happen to run next to each other. You already have to decide in Poland, which way you're going.
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@jon If ORM is correct there aren't any switches on the chech side connecting those tracks, so that these are technically just two single track lines that happen to run next to each other. You already have to decide in Poland, which way you're going.
@khaas Ah good spot! So yes, those count as separate borders then. But we still need to work out if any passenger train takes the one to Vrbice...
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@ptrc Excellent, thank you! And that was my suspicion too.
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Hmmm
The 2017 DG Regio report on #CrossBorderRail lines lists
Chalupki [PL] - Bohumín-Vrbice [CZ]as separate from
Chalupki [PL] - Bohumín [CZ]Because there is a connecting curve here:
https://openrailwaymap.org/?style=standard&lat=49.89919574726048&lon=18.33721160888672&zoom=141) Is there any passenger train on that curve? @wrzlbrnft do you know?
2) Is there any point listing them separately, as the cross border track section is the same?
@jon @wrzlbrnft There are no connections between the two tracks south-east of Chalupki, so they are separate lines.
I have the one to Vrbice as freight only in the map, but I might have missed something.
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I think the answer here is NOT to include former rail ferries (Gedser-Rostock and Helsingør-Helsingborg are not coming back), and working out where there were rail ferries is going to result in some weird outcomes
But anything with an idea to build a rail line - so including Helsingør-Helsingborg and Helsinki-Tallinn - ought to be included
And the latter I have visited - by ferry
@jon Do Helsingborg – Helsingør when you are coming that way and have time. It is quite fun. You can even go and visit Hamlet’s castle.
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@jon Do Helsingborg – Helsingør when you are coming that way and have time. It is quite fun. You can even go and visit Hamlet’s castle.
@partim I have been to both - the castle and the ferry. But in c. 2005!
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I think the answer here is NOT to include former rail ferries (Gedser-Rostock and Helsingør-Helsingborg are not coming back), and working out where there were rail ferries is going to result in some weird outcomes
But anything with an idea to build a rail line - so including Helsingør-Helsingborg and Helsinki-Tallinn - ought to be included
And the latter I have visited - by ferry
OK, these are the "ideas"/ "plans" for new #CrossBorderRail lines in Europe where the location of the border crossing is new
Bussoleno
- St Jean de Maurienne 
(Torino-Lyon)
Grafing
- Langkampfen 
(Brenner Nordzulauf)
Heidenau-Süd - Ústí nad Labem západ 
(Future HSL Berlin-Praha)
Helsingør
- Helsingborg 
(Fixed link idea)
Helsinki
- Tallinn 
(Rail Baltica tunnel)
Innsbruck - Fortezza (Brenner Base Tunnel)
Mszana
- Bohumín (CZ-PL CPK)
Mockava
- Trakiszki (Rail Baltica) -
OK, these are the "ideas"/ "plans" for new #CrossBorderRail lines in Europe where the location of the border crossing is new
Bussoleno
- St Jean de Maurienne (Torino-Lyon)
Grafing - Langkampfen (Brenner Nordzulauf)
Heidenau-Süd - Ústí nad Labem západ (Future HSL Berlin-Praha)
Helsingør - Helsingborg (Fixed link idea)
Helsinki - Tallinn (Rail Baltica tunnel)
Innsbruck - Fortezza (Brenner Base Tunnel)
Mszana - Bohumín (CZ-PL CPK)
Mockava - Trakiszki (Rail Baltica)I am not interested - for now! - in the likelihood these happen, but simply I am trying to add to my map all the possible new ones!
See the categories
Other (19)
Other - not visited (7)Here: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-all-the-borders_935041#5/51.686180/-0.329590
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I am not interested - for now! - in the likelihood these happen, but simply I am trying to add to my map all the possible new ones!
See the categories
Other (19)
Other - not visited (7)Here: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-all-the-borders_935041#5/51.686180/-0.329590
And as ever I am trying to list the first/last stations either side of the border, as is the way I have listed every other border on the map
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And damn there is another one
DG Regio lists
Helsingør [DK] - Helsingborg [SE]
the former rail ferry, and mentioned as a future location of a bridge or tunnelBut if I include former train ferries where am I going to stop?
Or are they eventually going to put a fixed link there?
https://www.myway.de/souvenirs/oeresund/index.html --> Öresund Rundt
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OK, these are the "ideas"/ "plans" for new #CrossBorderRail lines in Europe where the location of the border crossing is new
Bussoleno
- St Jean de Maurienne (Torino-Lyon)
Grafing - Langkampfen (Brenner Nordzulauf)
Heidenau-Süd - Ústí nad Labem západ (Future HSL Berlin-Praha)
Helsingør - Helsingborg (Fixed link idea)
Helsinki - Tallinn (Rail Baltica tunnel)
Innsbruck - Fortezza (Brenner Base Tunnel)
Mszana - Bohumín (CZ-PL CPK)
Mockava - Trakiszki (Rail Baltica)@jon There have also been talks about Vaasa (FI) - Umeå (SE) connection and Turku (FI) - Mariehamn (Åland) - Stockholm connection, both combining bridges, tunnels and open land rails. The first one of these is probably a bit more likely, but they're both wildly speculative
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@jon There have also been talks about Vaasa (FI) - Umeå (SE) connection and Turku (FI) - Mariehamn (Åland) - Stockholm connection, both combining bridges, tunnels and open land rails. The first one of these is probably a bit more likely, but they're both wildly speculative
@Stoori True. Hmmm. Those are both even more silly than a Helsinki-Tallinn tunnel, so maybe I can avoid those ones?
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And as ever I am trying to list the first/last stations either side of the border, as is the way I have listed every other border on the map
Meanwhile at Berlin Südkreuz only +10
Given the border control delay, and snow, that’s damned good!
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@Stoori True. Hmmm. Those are both even more silly than a Helsinki-Tallinn tunnel, so maybe I can avoid those ones?
@jon i guess so. tho Vaasa-Umeå ferry is the most relaxing ferry crossing i've ever been on, and i generally hate finnish ferries as they are full of drunk partygoers (whereas on this one they're absent), so i can honestly recommend it
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I am not interested - for now! - in the likelihood these happen, but simply I am trying to add to my map all the possible new ones!
See the categories
Other (19)
Other - not visited (7)Here: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-all-the-borders_935041#5/51.686180/-0.329590
@jon Are the proposed Sweden-Finland tunnel crossing the Gulf of Bothnia via Åland and/or the hypothetical eastern alternative to the Fehmarn Belt tunnel going between Gedser and Rostock too far-fetched to qualify?
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@jon Are the proposed Sweden-Finland tunnel crossing the Gulf of Bothnia via Åland and/or the hypothetical eastern alternative to the Fehmarn Belt tunnel going between Gedser and Rostock too far-fetched to qualify?
@acb Those are too far fetched I think yes
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And damn there is another one
DG Regio lists
Helsingør [DK] - Helsingborg [SE]
the former rail ferry, and mentioned as a future location of a bridge or tunnelBut if I include former train ferries where am I going to stop?
Or are they eventually going to put a fixed link there?
@jon The HH fixed link has been under discussion for decades. IIRC the main issue was the lack of the space needed on the Danish side, where existing railway line and ferry terminal are sandwiched in between the historic city center and the coast.
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OK, these are the "ideas"/ "plans" for new #CrossBorderRail lines in Europe where the location of the border crossing is new
Bussoleno
- St Jean de Maurienne (Torino-Lyon)
Grafing - Langkampfen (Brenner Nordzulauf)
Heidenau-Süd - Ústí nad Labem západ (Future HSL Berlin-Praha)
Helsingør - Helsingborg (Fixed link idea)
Helsinki - Tallinn (Rail Baltica tunnel)
Innsbruck - Fortezza (Brenner Base Tunnel)
Mszana - Bohumín (CZ-PL CPK)
Mockava - Trakiszki (Rail Baltica)@jon@gruene.social I think Mockava - Trakiszki is a bit funny to include when it only moves by ~300 meters
