Are social networks unhealthy for minors?
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@monnier @evan I never said it was unhealthy only for minors.
I believe the poll is about the recent bans, and those wouldn't apply to adults, just like we don't ban alcohol for adults even though it's unhealthy for everyone.
There is probably also an unlimited number of things you can replace GAFAM with, but it's also going off topic, I'm only clarifying why I responded no to the poll
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@evan social networks or social media?
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Folks, I know this is a heated issue, but please be respectful of other people in the comments. You can disagree without attacking people personally.
I have a hard line about telling people they are unfit to be parents. That's not an acceptable thing to say to another human being.
I've had to block a couple of people already. It's really disappointing.
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@evan social networks or social media?
@cam what is the difference, to you?
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I deleted my instagram January 1st and, initially, I missed my computer connections but what I noticed as the time went by was that I didn’t feel this urge to photograph curated pictures anymore. I still take lots of pictures every day of things I see, but they’re mine so I don’t care if they’re not perfect.
I also have a handwritten journal, on paper, so I can write for myself.
Doing things for yourself is good, man.
Excuse me, bartender
Yeah, whatever Renata here is having next, please make it a double and put it on my tab.
Because Renata here has hit the nail on the motor-flippin head!
Sing it!
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@cam what is the difference, to you?
@evan social networks exist regardless of tech medium, kids have caretakers, friends, peers, etc. social media is the medium, it usually mirrors your social network but with the tech co intermediary.
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@evan I struggled between yes, but and no, but.
Inherently, being part of a social group can be important esp. when you're the type who doesn't mix normally (me in my youth.. 0 friends but my ZX Spectrum.. would have killed for something like Mastodon back then).
But the way they're run by corporations with no thought for the damage their algorithms can do.. just more eyeballs means more profit.. makes them a toxic place. We need to fix that.
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I've had to block a couple of people already. It's really disappointing.
@evan I know. I pride myself on Freedom of speech.
Dialogue is the only way we can all get along, whether we agree with each other or not. Sadly, some people don't deserve that level of respect.
I've put up with a lot of shit flung at me over the years. I'm happy to be insulted to a certain degree, be denigrated, have my words twisted, and often be lied about, but there comes a time when enough is enough, and I have to hit the Mute button.
They have to be extremely bad for me to block them.
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@evan I never felt like SoundCloud was unhealthy, or IRC back in my days. But yes the so called social media that is just algorithmic based spitting out horseshit of content and bullshit ads absolutely are.
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@evan I know. I pride myself on Freedom of speech.
Dialogue is the only way we can all get along, whether we agree with each other or not. Sadly, some people don't deserve that level of respect.
I've put up with a lot of shit flung at me over the years. I'm happy to be insulted to a certain degree, be denigrated, have my words twisted, and often be lied about, but there comes a time when enough is enough, and I have to hit the Mute button.
They have to be extremely bad for me to block them.
@dick_turpin not me! I am a one-strike blocker. If I find myself typing something angry at someone, I stop myself and block instead. (Usually.)
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@evan
For me, it’s a “No, but…”. I grew up using BBS (only for a short time) and then Usenet. There have always been toxic elements there, and certainly not everything was age-appropriate. So it’s also a reflection of society. And today, especially on commercial networks, that reflection of society is the attention economy and the greed for data.Everyone has a responsibility to ensure that these networks are safe for all users. Children should not simply be shielded from them, but rather taught how to use these media. They will find a way to participate anyway.
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Folks, I know this is a heated issue, but please be respectful of other people in the comments. You can disagree without attacking people personally.
I have a hard line about telling people they are unfit to be parents. That's not an acceptable thing to say to another human being.
@evan fedi has a particularly viscious streak in general rn imo, im actually struggling to reccomend it to anyone
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@evan yes, but they can also be one of the only safe spaces/resourses for certain marginalized youths (broken homes, lgbtq kids, disabled kids, etc) and i honestly think preventing this abuse is worth the risks.
Sure, but what you have there is a desperate cry for, a ringing endorsement of, far better outreach and supports IRL for exactly those situations (and by extension, every situation!)
And with that, I absolutely do not disagree!
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@dick_turpin not me! I am a one-strike blocker. If I find myself typing something angry at someone, I stop myself and block instead. (Usually.)
@evan Ah, the old Knee-jerk reaction, aye?
Christ, how have we managed to stay friends for eighteen years?
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@evan fedi has a particularly viscious streak in general rn imo, im actually struggling to reccomend it to anyone
@kim I get it; it's a tough time in the world and people see it as a way to blow off steam. Blocking is good, modeling good behaviour is good. We can get there.
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(1/2) @evan I've always opposed sanitizing the world for kids.
They *will* get online & find stuff. I did (just w/BBS's!).I *am* sure so-called “social media” *is* toxic for kids. Heck:it's toxic for most adults.
But age verification laws'll put 16 yr olds into business of making fake ids for 10 yr olds.
My mother read Tipper Gore's book & Destroyed all my #punk tapes.
Lars brought me his to school to listen to free.
& the censorship made me an activist for life. So, maybe upsides?
#EvanPoll(2/2) I think often about this old #JelloBiafra spoken word piece as these #AgeVerification laws have been suddenly moving rapidly:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1qOBOooFbHY&t=13m3s
My favorite part: “If [my] child… brought home something…harmful to their emotional growth…like, say, the film _Top Gun_…or a Sammy Hagar album…I wouldn't hit the roof & grab the whole thing away…I'd [instead] sit down with the kid [& ask]: “Tell me why you like it? … [I'll listen then] I'll tell you why I don't like it” -
@red_the_bean My blocklist is not a democracy. You don't get a vote. My attention is my exclusive resource to control.
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@evan Yes, but mostly because creating safe digital spaces for minors is difficult. You need crack moderation teams and robust digital safety plans, as well as actually having their best interests at heart. Very difficult goal to align with those of for-profit companies, extremely difficult to implement by independent groups due to lack of funding. Not to mention the tension that anonymity protects but many protective measures require at least the identification that a user is a minor.
We choose to go to the moon in this decade, and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard.
We, the human race, especially in the western, in the northern, world have got faaaaar too soft. Too often we see challenges as something to be avoided, rather than to be met head on, and to overcome.
I'm positive the expansion of The Internet, of Social Media has been a factor in that.... I would even not be surprised by evidence that those who created these Social Media's did so at least in part to help make us softer, make us more challenge averse....
Though I may be getting into Tinfoil Hat territory......
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